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2E Lodges - Conversions and Homebrew

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Deionscribe View Post
    I definitely second "creatures of sin" as the Sacred Prey. We can also include Slashers into that category, and perhaps even the Shuankhsen and (low Integrity) Heroes?
    Would you base it on the seven sins? One would think breakers of the ten commandments or places of heathen worship would be more high priority for something so close to god. But then you might have to limit it to Ghost Wolves, what with the first.

    Why would the Image, or whatever totem, want sinners dead in sacred hunts?

    Basically are you trying to hold closer to religious belief? Or are you trying to make evil-smiting paladins?
    Last edited by nofather; 08-31-2016, 06:25 PM.

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    • #62
      Thanks to all your suggestions. I really love the ban of "Never desecrate the house of the Lord", and I think I'll use it.

      I liked the idea of Sacred Prey of: "Those that war against the Image of God"

      I also like the suggestion of "Creatures of Sin", representing Bale Hounds, Wound Spirits..., but I think I'll use it for a Lodge I'm creating which is centered in battling the Bale Hounds.


      But, as ZealousChristian24 has said, the Lodge has a Totem, the Image, But It's poorly fleshed. I think I'll flesh it with more detail, following the suggestion of Acrozatariim.

      By the way, the context of my question is a detailed setting of Hunting Grounds: Spain.
      In my setting, a lot of local werewolves are very influenced by religion. Lodge of Saviour ihas a lot of influence, and also there's another one called Los Cruzados de Santiago (Crusaders of St. James) which is the most powerful and with most influence Lodge in Spain (I'll come later with it).


      LAND OF THE DAMNED: SPAIN (Spanish): Land of the Damned: Spain, Kingdoms of Blood: Spain; Cities of the Damned: Barcelona, Valencia, Carthian Constitution (1812), Three Arrows Pact:

      OTHERS (Spanish): Demon: The Redemption, Bloodlines: The Forgotten

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Uxas View Post
        I'm trying to convert the Lodge o the Saviour to Second Edition, does someone has some ideas?

        BOND

        Blessing: ¿?

        Aspiration: Bring the salvation of Our Lord Jesus Christ to other werewolves.

        Ban: Never Hunting good christians?


        SACRED HUNT
        ?????

        TOOLS
        Lodge members have access to the Blood Rosary Fetish (o)
        They also have access to the Lodge Merits: Connections (limited t christian churches or organizations) and ¿Sorcery? ¿Lorehouse?
        May be some rite related to church rites and Sacraments (as a Uratha version of Eucharisty or some rite of Confession who helps to resist Harmony breaking points or to recover Harmony)?
        Blessing Idea:
        Know Soul Dread Power, with things incapable of breaking points showing as "Amoral or Immoral".


        “Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.” ~ Aristophanes
        "Virescit Vulnere Virtus" ~ Stewart Clan Motto

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        • #64
          Some questions about a new Lodge 'm creating for a Spanish setting.

          Its name is "Cruzados de Santiago" (Crusaders of St. James) and was born during the Spanish Reconquista (the war of the christians kingdoms against the muslim kingdoms in Spain). Most of its members are spacially Storm Lords (in some regions, new Changed Storm Lords are initiated to the Tribe and to the Lodge at the same time, as if they were the same) and Blood Talons, although it has members of all tribes).

          Its patron spirit is the "Sword of the Prophet" (I've still have to translate its name to First Tongue), although it's mainly known among werewolves as the Sword of the Apostle. That's a reference of the legend of Santiago Matamoros (St. James Moor-slayer) who was one of the saints most venerated during the Reconquista (and today is the saint patron of Spain). Most Crusaders believe there's some relationship between their patron and the saint, but a few of them even identify it as the saint).

          Their patron was born as a small conceptual spirit of the Reconquista (a holy war spirit), who became the Totem of a pack. With time, after consuming conceptual spirits of Islam (as its prey) and other spirits of Reconquista, christian faith and war he grow until becoming the patron spirit of a lodge (its pack also had recruited other members to its cause, growing exponentially).

          With the pass of centuries, he continued growing until he became the Spirit of Spain, devouring other rivals during the process and the old spirit of Spain, who lost a lot of power after the muslim conquest. Today he's still the spirit of Spain, although he has rivals for that title. He represents the most traditional aspects of spanish culture (the most ultracatholic and conservative Spain), but in 19th century was born a rival candidate, la Dama República (Lady Republic), who is the spirit of the most progressive Spain.
          As there's been a constant ighting beteen those two ideas of Spain ("las dos Españas" -the two Spains-) in the last century between mostals, there's also been a combat of the conceptual spirits of those two ideas of Spain.
          As their patron spirit has increased in power, the Lodge also has become more and more important and powerful.

          Its concept is based in the Lodge of the Black Woods, from Lodges: The Splintered. It was very common initiate full packs as new members, and membership in the Lodge was not exclusive, accepting membership from other Lodges. My doubt is if with new Lodge rules, is still possible a Lodge who accepts membership from other Lodges (so those members will gain two blessings, Sacred Hunts, bans and Tools.
          If it's not possible in 2nd Edition, I've thought may be in an honorary membership for some sympatizer werewolves bit not fully-commited: acces to the tools, having to respect the ban and the aspiration, but without access to the blessing and Sacred Hunt benefits.


          LAND OF THE DAMNED: SPAIN (Spanish): Land of the Damned: Spain, Kingdoms of Blood: Spain; Cities of the Damned: Barcelona, Valencia, Carthian Constitution (1812), Three Arrows Pact:

          OTHERS (Spanish): Demon: The Redemption, Bloodlines: The Forgotten

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          • #65
            I doubt they'd get the Blessing and Sacred Hunt benefit, but, as you suggested, they'd likely allow nominal participation in their ceremonies and freely trade merits and rites as long as they work out mutual trades and respect the views of the Lodge.

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            • #66
              I think a lodge totem like that, especially one that seems so dedicated to loyalty and its belief over others wouldn't really put up with other lodges.

              It doesn't seem the most inclusive and accommodating of spirits. I suppose it might 'let' other lodges exist providing they offered up tithes, but I can't see it letting them in. Lodges are cults, the totems need loyalty.

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              • #67
                Originally posted by Uxas View Post
                My doubt is if with new Lodge rules, is still possible a Lodge who accepts membership from other Lodges (so those members will gain two blessings, Sacred Hunts, bans and Tools.
                If it's not possible in 2nd Edition, I've thought may be in an honorary membership for some sympatizer werewolves bit not fully-commited: acces to the tools, having to respect the ban and the aspiration, but without access to the blessing and Sacred Hunt benefits.
                It is my understanding that werewolf Lodges are like vampire Bloodlines, changeling Entitlements, and mage Legacies in that members can only belong to one. I like nofather 's suggestion of this lodge requiring tithes or tribute in areas where they are dominate. They seem very aggressive in their recruitment so dominating is likely unless they are likewise aggressively opposed.

                Three question: Why are they Stormlords instead Fire-Touched? Fire-Touched seem a very appropriate Tribe for the description you gave, more so than Stormlords. Are you creating this for Player Characters to participate in? Are you the storyteller or a player in the Chronicle these are meant to portrayed in.


                “Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.” ~ Aristophanes
                "Virescit Vulnere Virtus" ~ Stewart Clan Motto

                Comment


                • #68
                  I also like the nofather suggestion of Tribute and Tithe. I'd include that in a later rewritting.

                  About your three questions, I'll begin with the two last ones because it helps to explain the others.

                  Originally posted by Pale_Crusader View Post
                  Are you creating this for Player Characters to participate in? Are you the storyteller or a player in the Chronicle these are meant to portrayed in.
                  Neither. I'm creating it as a macrosetting for all Spain. It'll be a big fan book about 500 or more pages. I wrote some years ago a similar setting for Spain vampires, and now I'm expanding it to werewolves. But although I haven't finished it, I'm also translating what I wrote to 2nd Edition rules.


                  Originally posted by Pale_Crusader View Post
                  Why are they Stormlords instead Fire-Touched? Fire-Touched seem a very appropriate Tribe for the description you gave, more so than Stormlords.
                  Two reasons. The first one is that in the setting, religion has a strong influence in local werewolves. In modern days, not so much, but during the Reconquista against the moors, it was more important. Local werewolves participated in the Reconquista either helping christian armies or muslim. The truth is that most werewolves were fighting just for new territories, but the Reconquista was the religious and ideological excuse for attacking ther southern brothers. In fact, there is among Spanish Forsaken the (false) stereotype than the Reconquista was a war against Pure werewolves from muslim kingdoms (although the Pure only were dominant in the last centuries of muslim Spain, durin the Almohade and Almoravid invasions).
                  Although most of Werewolves fought really for territorial conquests, there were a few faatical ones who really fought for religious reasons, the Crusaders of Santiago, who became allies with the Lodge of the Savior, in an alliance similar to the Church and nobility in the Middle Ages.

                  The second reason is that when I created them first time, I followed the 1st Edition stereotype of the Storm Lords as the alfas of the alfas in Forsaken culture. With the change in 2nd Edition, I'll have to change that. I had stablished that the muslim werewolves were more tolerant with spirits than the christian ones. I'll probably remark that strongly, so there would be more Claimed in Muslim kingdoms than in Christian ones. So the Storm Lords were very interested in hunt them.

                  Changing them to Fire-Touched would need a great setting change. But I also like your suggestion of them.I'm going to include a Middle Ages Lodge which rivalized with the Crusaders in Christian Spain, but who finally was defeated probably during the Castillian Civil Wars between Peter the Cruel and Henry of Trastamara (in fact, I have in the current setting an Ivory Claw who claims being descendant of Peter the Cruel).
                  Last edited by Uxas; 09-13-2016, 04:42 PM.


                  LAND OF THE DAMNED: SPAIN (Spanish): Land of the Damned: Spain, Kingdoms of Blood: Spain; Cities of the Damned: Barcelona, Valencia, Carthian Constitution (1812), Three Arrows Pact:

                  OTHERS (Spanish): Demon: The Redemption, Bloodlines: The Forgotten

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Uxas View Post
                    Changing them to Fire-Touched would need a great setting change. But I also like your suggestion of them.I'm going to include a Middle Ages Lodge which rivalized with the Crusaders in Christian Spain, but who finally was defeated probably during the Castillian Civil Wars between Peter the Cruel and Henry of Trastamara (in fact, I have in the current setting an Ivory Claw who claims being descendant of Peter the Cruel).
                    Or you could have a Pure off-shoot of original Lodge. Totem doesn't care on what side werewolves work for him...


                    My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
                    LGBT+ through Ages
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                    • #70
                      Yes, in fact, I have something similar with a enemy Lodge from Catalonia, which inducts both Pure and Forsaken. In Barcelona (and, in a lesser extent, all Catalonia), there's a Lodge (Lodge of St George) who are the alphas in the region, and whose members are both Pure and Forsaken, in an antinatural coalition of both factions.

                      EDIT: But yeah. I could go by your suggestion. But instead of being a lodge eith Pures and Forsaken working together for a common cause (as in Catalonia), in this case both would be deadly enemies. They even wouldn't know that their patron us the same (it would appear as a different to each Lodge).
                      Last edited by Uxas; 09-14-2016, 02:03 AM.


                      LAND OF THE DAMNED: SPAIN (Spanish): Land of the Damned: Spain, Kingdoms of Blood: Spain; Cities of the Damned: Barcelona, Valencia, Carthian Constitution (1812), Three Arrows Pact:

                      OTHERS (Spanish): Demon: The Redemption, Bloodlines: The Forgotten

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        I have an idea for a lodge of thieves that foil plans that could harm their territory by stealing a critical component of that plan. It is inspired by a couple of stories out of new york city where terrorist bomb plots were inadvertently foiled when a thief either stole or attempted to steal the container the bomb was in, thus preventing it from going off (one of the stories (which may or may not be true) involves a pair of thieves that accidentally disabled one of the Chelsea bombs by stealing the fancy suitcase it was in and dumping the bomb out, which somehow disabled it, and the other one is a story where a car thief tried to steal a van, only to discover that the van was full of explosives and then called the police after moving the van to an abandoned waterfront area from the residential area it was in.).

                        The idea may very well work better in demon, but if it were a lodge, I can't figure out what their blessing would be. I think their sacred hunt benefit would be being able to sense if their prey's plans (if any) is dependent on something material/stealable and being able to track that something as if it were the prey.


                        Despite the user name I am actually bigender.

                        My Savannah Setting for CofD can be found here

                        My heroes as monster tamers rules for BtP can be found here

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                        • #72
                          Originally posted by The young man in the cafe View Post
                          I have an idea for a lodge of thieves that foil plans that could harm their territory by stealing a critical component of that plan. It is inspired by a couple of stories out of new york city where terrorist bomb plots were inadvertently foiled when a thief either stole or attempted to steal the container the bomb was in, thus preventing it from going off (one of the stories (which may or may not be true) involves a pair of thieves that accidentally disabled one of the Chelsea bombs by stealing the fancy suitcase it was in and dumping the bomb out, which somehow disabled it, and the other one is a story where a car thief tried to steal a van, only to discover that the van was full of explosives and then called the police after moving the van to an abandoned waterfront area from the residential area it was in.).

                          The idea may very well work better in demon, but if it were a lodge, I can't figure out what their blessing would be. I think their sacred hunt benefit would be being able to sense if their prey's plans (if any) is dependent on something material/stealable and being able to track that something as if it were the prey.
                          Hmm. Going by the conversation in the Stranger Bedfellows thread (regarding the section of the same name in The Pack)... what about having a Demon as the Lodge's totem? Need to know a core component of a prey's plan? Heart's Desire Embed, or some Interlock or Lambda incorporating it.

                          * For reference, the writer of the section was citing a Changeling as a possible Pack totem. If Changeling, why not Demon?


                          Malkydel: "And the Machine dictated; let there be adequate illumination."
                          Yossarian: "And lo, it was optimal."

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                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Vent0 View Post

                            Hmm. Going by the conversation in the Stranger Bedfellows thread (regarding the section of the same name in The Pack)... what about having a Demon as the Lodge's totem? Need to know a core component of a prey's plan? Heart's Desire Embed, or some Interlock or Lambda incorporating it.

                            * For reference, the writer of the section was citing a Changeling as a possible Pack totem. If Changeling, why not Demon?
                            I like it, a demon that had such a lodge working for it probably also sometimes sends them to steal the lynchpins of certain GM plots, akin to the golden grin casino heist in payday 2. It creates a very nice crime.net sort of lodge.


                            Despite the user name I am actually bigender.

                            My Savannah Setting for CofD can be found here

                            My heroes as monster tamers rules for BtP can be found here

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                            • #74
                              That seems less like a lodge and more of a pack aligned with a demon.

                              A lodge is a cult, with obedience and ritual and direction. This group is just protecting their territory.

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                              • #75
                                Originally posted by nofather View Post
                                That seems less like a lodge and more of a pack aligned with a demon.

                                A lodge is a cult, with obedience and ritual and direction. This group is just protecting their territory.
                                I get what you're saying, and I am thinking the lodge would be an "Across the western world" thing, the totem has it's followers steal to protect their territory so that they can acquire wealth to pursue the totem's goals, which happen to align with theft and gaining influence in various organized crime groups.

                                sort of a lodge of thieves dedicated to a totem representing the more romanticized thief.

                                I am basically imagining Bain from the payday games as a totem for a lodge.


                                Despite the user name I am actually bigender.

                                My Savannah Setting for CofD can be found here

                                My heroes as monster tamers rules for BtP can be found here

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