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What they need to clear up when they do a world atlas (Problems with Aeon's Earth.

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post

    That’s exactly the anoying point, we call Nippon (tha japanese for Japan) and call Persia (the non local name for Iran). Why? If it was up to me, I would say that as religion lost some power and the government would want to be more inclusive with the invaded countries, they changed to a more “neutral” or “friendly”, but the descriptions says the name was changed before the reduction on religion in politics. So... weird...

    Also, not sure if Iran or Iraq that dominated the others and become Persia “After Iran expanded into Turkmenistan and the still-habitable portions of Iran, “ (Aeon, page 68). My bet is Iran invaded the remaining of Iraq as half or Iraq is in the wastelands.
    Well, in our own current real world, Iraq has pretty much fallen into Iran's orbit along with Syria. Maybe they were extrapolating from that?

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    • #62
      Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post
      More than once I questioned, WHY ANYONE MIGRATES TO FSA? its like nowadays migrating to Congo or North Korea (nothing against those countries, but all the wars and the dictators... not a good place to live). Anyone stupid enough to move to FSA would be treated as less than a person, why would they stay there?

      Europe is destroyed? Sure, but Australia would receive them smiling, Sudamerica and Africa would give them on a better condition (not great, but still better), the Extra Solar Colonies would be happy to have more fresh meat, Oceania would also need some people to gain political representation in general. Why FSA?
      Yeah the whole FSA is a big eyeroll to me. It feels it was done less as a fun nuanced part of the setting and more of a pat yourself on the back political point. And cool that means if you are Mexican or North American First Nation your stories are mostly non existent.

      And it really seems eyeroll-y to have Japan called Nippon, that's silly that's that's like if we made a setting and China can't call America Meiguo and they only call it America. Or Greece isn't Greece anymore only Hellas. Or India is Bharat. Honestly to me its as silly as using Kueijin.


      It is a time for great deeds!

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post

        Yeah the whole FSA is a big eyeroll to me. It feels it was done less as a fun nuanced part of the setting and more of a pat yourself on the back political point.
        It’s only a ‘pat yourself on the back political point’ if you think FSA was written after America headed down the path it’s now on. In fact, first edition FSA was written way before this, and second edition FSA was written during the (generally) more hopeful times of the Obama administration.

        In both instances, the FSA isn’t intended as any real world political commentary. It’s intended as a corporate cyberpunk dystopia so you can run Shadowrun and Cyberpunk-type games If you want to.


        Writer. Developer. World of Darkness | Chronicles of Darkness | The Trinity Continuum

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        • #64
          Even in the early two thousands I've known people that would have patted considered these
          ‘pat yourself on the back political point’ settings, not at all limiting it to modern day.

          But things start to come apart at the seems when you try to mash, Judge Dredd/Star Trek/Shadowrun/Bladerunner/Mad Max/Fallout/Mass Effect in the same setting. For one Economy seems wonky when you consider off world resources would be exponentially greater then terrestrial ones but a lot of that is toned down so you can have access to some setting cohesions of these Genre locals.

          It just seems you can't quite do each Genre/homage justice in a combined setting. Corporate Dystopia becomes more and more headscratchy when you consider how most of the world works, and that off world colonies are a thing.


          It would work better using different planets as a microcosm rather then different countries, but then you lose a lot when its not set in actual England or actual Japan.

          And it just seems conquering Mexico and Canada is way more trouble then its worth as an answer to a resource shortage when you literally have Hyperfusion. If it was something like taking Tech, or even a rare type of Populace ( like I don't know they wanted to breed new Novas or some sort of superhuman) yeah but food and water... you essentially cannonball your own position in world diplomacy and economy for something massive vertical farming procedures could have taken care of. I mean verisimilitude damage can be curbed with further explanations in other supplements, but its on shaky ground. Why Dystopian Cyberpunk settings and other post apocalyptic settings work is because they exist in a mostly universal state. Otherwise you are asking why is Captain Picard allowing jackboots and brainwashing on his front lawn.

          Not a jab but from my experience many people have loved Trinity and Scion in both iterations but they were always much more willing to make the setting their own as compared to the two world of Darknesses where most of the time I see people play the setting as is unless doing a special chronicle every now and then, (Werewolves... in... SPAAAAAaaaaace!).


          It is a time for great deeds!

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          • #65
            Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
            Yeah the whole FSA is a big eyeroll to me. It feels it was done less as a fun nuanced part of the setting and more of a pat yourself on the back political point. And cool that means if you are Mexican or North American First Nation your stories are mostly non existent.
            There is plenty of stories to be told in FSA, they just don’t follow the original Meta-Plot. Cyberpunk and Shadowrun for example have a huge number of good material to be used as base. But cyberpunk in general works on local scale while we tend to run Aeon on the macro setting, removing most of the isolated countries from the game (it includes FSA, Nippon and Persia).


            House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
            Fists of Flux - Inspired and Powered Martial Arts for Talents
            Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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            • #66
              Early 2000s was another weird time. Most of the Europe and South America were getting deeper on the left/labor side of the scale, while America was becoming more and more “security aware” and taking rights away for national security reasons. This setting was written in the 90s, before 9/11 and during a time the news were about a secretary doing BJs in the oval room, not about war, how youth is distorting economy and right/left wings. America was in constant war, sure, but USSR was gone and there was no China to compete with USA. America was in the best place in its history.


              House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
              Fists of Flux - Inspired and Powered Martial Arts for Talents
              Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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              • #67
                Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post
                Early 2000s was another weird time. Most of the Europe and South America were getting deeper on the left/labor side of the scale, while America was becoming more and more “security aware” and taking rights away for national security reasons. This setting was written in the 90s, before 9/11 and during a time the news were about a secretary doing BJs in the oval room, not about war, how youth is distorting economy and right/left wings. America was in constant war, sure, but USSR was gone and there was no China to compete with USA. America was in the best place in its history.
                I chalked it up to teenagers being edgey and familiarity breeding contempt, both of which seem universal. The same people who I heard saying 9/11 didn't matter because it was the US would have probably said the same thing if we were born a decade earlier.

                But how close are the two editions expected to be? I'm mostly talking 2nd ed. And with Exalted they took more liberties changing from 2nd to 3rd ed then 1st to 2nd.


                It is a time for great deeds!

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                • #68
                  They changed a lot the entire world. For example Norça was a bunch of narcos and they become ecoterrorists. but FSA is still basically the same.

                  The true is FSA is not the center of any thing in the setting. the America Offline supplement from first edition added more about the relationship Aeon Trinity x FSA and Orgotek x FSA than about the country itself (as long as I recall, I didn't read it cover to cover and what I read was a few year back).

                  We don't need to make FSA as bad as it is portrayed, even without breaking the descriptions for the setting. It is pacific most of time, you can go for some bounty hunting after both ilegal people and criminals, or doing some jobs for the mega corporations, there is the Blight covering a huge part of the countryside and giving a lot of opportunities for monster hunting, all that without touching politics.

                  The life of poor people in FSA is not different from the life of poor immigrants in USA now, they don't get access to voting and can be sent to concentration camps if bringing too much official attention to you (like the ones they are putting the ilegal immigrants nowadays). If you prefer you can go for legal and political things (like the modern day Washington DC movies, but representing companies and not the people), or can work as a "double agent" working and trafficking information between 2 mega corporations as if they were countries.

                  The point in FSA is really it is not part of the main meta plot (originally), but as there is no meta plot in second edition, there is nothing that would keep you away form FSA (except if you are not a citizen...)


                  House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
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                  • #69
                    I mean I'm poor in the US now and I don't have voting restrictions or threat of being sent to a concentration camp... so it does sound different from now...


                    It is a time for great deeds!

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                    • #70
                      I look at the Aeon setting and I think of the Orders and I think of space, I don't really think of the Earth nations itself. I would have much preferred if something like a global Earth government had been formed in the aftermath of the war that looks like its a single government but that when you dig deeper all the conflicts of the old states are still there, just hidden.

                      All that said the FSA is the opposite of interesting and fun for me and so its something I don't think I would ever focus my ST attention on.

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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                        I mean I'm poor in the US now and I don't have voting restrictions or threat of being sent to a concentration camp... so it does sound different from now...
                        what I meant was poor people would be treated like poor IMMIGRANTS.

                        they only risk being overcharged for crimes if they are criminals or be framed, otherwise they are just poor...
                        Last edited by Mateus Luz; 02-16-2020, 10:47 PM.


                        House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
                        Fists of Flux - Inspired and Powered Martial Arts for Talents
                        Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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                        • #72
                          Originally posted by LordHeru View Post
                          All that said the FSA is the opposite of interesting and fun for me and so its something I don't think I would ever focus my ST attention on.
                          Agree. I would prefer something more like the Expanse, a global earth government and the colonies working towards their independence.

                          But still, the opportunities are there...


                          House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
                          Fists of Flux - Inspired and Powered Martial Arts for Talents
                          Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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                          • #73
                            FSA honestly could work with just being an example of democratic backsliding. I think the addition of corptocracy is kind of just an unneeded layer myself. Like, I don't mind it on prinicple. I think it's more that the specific implementation is a bit late 90s/early 00s in its nature.


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                            • #74
                              Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post

                              That’s exactly the anoying point, we call Nippon (tha japanese for Japan) and call Persia (the non local name for Iran). Why? If it was up to me, I would say that as religion lost some power and the government would want to be more inclusive with the invaded countries, they changed to a more “neutral” or “friendly”, but the descriptions says the name was changed before the reduction on religion in politics. So... weird...

                              Also, not sure if Iran or Iraq that dominated the others and become Persia “After Iran expanded into Turkmenistan and the still-habitable portions of Iran, “ (Aeon, page 68). My bet is Iran invaded the remaining of Iraq as half or Iraq is in the wastelands.
                              So Iran never actually called itself Persia. But it was the official exonym for the country until the early 20th Century. In the forming of nationalism though, Iran being the name for the state had additiona meaning as it was not the name for a specific ethnic group, but the country. About half of Iran today is what we would call ethnically Persian. It also has Arabs, Kurds, Turks, Pashtuns, and all sorts of other groups living in there. Reza Shah formally asked other countries to stop referring ot the country as Persia and to Iran if they could, and the country that most dragged its foot on it was the UK.

                              (There's an amusing video on the topic here, though I'll note that I actually knew about all thsi before it. Just found it neat there's a summary video on the topic.)

                              But yeah, in context of "Trying to find a name that covers the area more" it is actually a less useful therm than Iran is, as Iranshahr/Greater Iran encompasses a lot more than the modern state or Aeon Persia.
                              Last edited by Blaque; 02-17-2020, 05:20 AM.


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                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post

                                Yeah the whole FSA is a big eyeroll to me. It feels it was done less as a fun nuanced part of the setting and more of a pat yourself on the back political point. And cool that means if you are Mexican or North American First Nation your stories are mostly non existent.

                                And it really seems eyeroll-y to have Japan called Nippon, that's silly that's that's like if we made a setting and China can't call America Meiguo and they only call it America. Or Greece isn't Greece anymore only Hellas. Or India is Bharat. Honestly to me its as silly as using Kueijin.
                                It is something that does happen today though. See the official want of the Latinization of Kiev to Kyev and dropping "the" from Ukraine, the recent name changes of Eswatini (formerly Swaziland), Czechia (now an offical alternative to the Czech Republic), and the changed Anglizations of various Indian cities such as Mumbai or Kulkuta. You see it in other areas too, such as the Japanese government requesting that Japanese names, when translated into other langauges, retain the surname first pattern. (Something often done for Chinese and Korean names already)

                                Persia is also awkward in context of Aeon, since Nippon, Sudoamerica, Bharati, andMagyarorszag are obvious use of endonyms, yet one of the biggest ones seem to be a change for its own sake, since Iran use to be Persia and authors thought that it was a return ot the pre-colonial name, rather the opposite.


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