DCU/MU Character builds for Aberrant?

[Seeker1728]

While I personally feel the Aberrant world is a interesting blend of Iron & Modern age comics in print, I have a number of friends who are die hard fans of the DC and Marvel comics franchises. Unfortunately, since the rules are available to backers only and I didn't get in on time for that, I was wondering if there are any backers who made examples or threads of anyone putting iconic characters of those studios in Aberrant terms? I.E. Batman, Magneto, Green Lantern, Captain America, etc.

TIA

[Penelope]

I’m not familiar with any but that’s a good idea.

[LordHeru]

I was going to but there was much confusion with how some of the aberrant powers worked when the kickstarter came out and so I decided to just wait before diving into the deep end of character building. I think a lot of others did the same. Though if you look around the forum with Aberrant you might find some basic ideas posted.

[Penelope]

LordHeru has a good point. Maybe best to wait till after the final product comes out on DTRPG.

[Shepherdboi]

There were two threads that I know of that discussed stats for the Hulk. I posted my version in the second thread:
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...to-create-hulk
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...d-beta-edition

A few big problems with making comic book character conversions at this time is that the Power Suite rules (which make your powers much more versatile) were getting an overhaul post-kickstarter, I'm pretty sure the Durability mega-edge was getting reworked, and the Transformation power (which I used to model the Hulk) seemed simultaneously too powerful and too restrictive.

Going further into creating the Hulk, Transformation assumes everyone gets an infinite number of alternate forms even at level 1. There doesn't seem to be any default way to lower stats (like the Hulk being less intelligent than Dr. Banner). You can use it for physical Mega-Attributes, but not the associated Mega-Edges. So making the Hulk using the kickstarter presentation of the Transformation power requires a lot of Storyteller decisions, which is odd since a regular guy who transforms into a big, tough tank is a simple and frequently used trope.

[Penelope]

There were two threads that I know of that discussed stats for the Hulk. I posted my version in the second thread:
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...to-create-hulk
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...d-beta-edition

A few big problems with making comic book character conversions at this time is that the Power Suite rules (which make your powers much more versatile) were getting an overhaul post-kickstarter, I'm pretty sure the Durability mega-edge was getting reworked, and the Transformation power (which I used to model the Hulk) seemed simultaneously too powerful and too restrictive.

Going further into creating the Hulk, Transformation assumes everyone gets an infinite number of alternate forms even at level 1. There doesn't seem to be any default way to lower stats (like the Hulk being less intelligent than Dr. Banner). You can use it for physical Mega-Attributes, but not the associated Mega-Edges. So making the Hulk using the kickstarter presentation of the Transformation power requires a lot of Storyteller decisions, which is odd since a regular guy who transforms into a big, tough tank is a simple and frequently used trope.

Interesting. I didn’t read the Kickstarter so I wasn’t familiar with all those issues. Thanks.

[Mateus Luz]

This issues are not that big, but they do limit how to model characters.

The Durability (and in fact all armor like powers) were described using a terms that don’t fit the rules and were not explained anywhere, but could be understood.

Transformation is the Beast Bot power, transform into animals or gain powers related to physical body, and fir that ends it works fine, there is also material chameleon, that is similar but copying material properties, also works fine (except for interacting with some powers) but there is no “elemental body” or “alternate form” or anything similar that transform you into a single alternate form, like the Hulk, Colossus, Human Torch etc, characters that have a set of powers in their human form and have another form with another set of powers (big, green and mega strong) or a more powerful set of powers (Biler proof, can fly, etc).

The technique issue is the least of the problems as Danielle already told how it’s going to work, but the point is, the way it was written in the manuscript creates some loop holes that make you capable of infinite powers of same level as long as you have 1 tag added to the power. Danielle suggested it would become a Mega Edge that allow you get one additional power (technique) to your power array per dot in the Mega Edge, it creates a limit of 1 + quantum powers per power suit (as intended before).

[Seeker1728]

My apologies all, life, work, computer going super-critical, prevented me from replying till now. Thank you to those who responded already:

This issues are not that big, but they do limit how to model characters.

The Durability (and in fact all armor like powers) were described using a terms that don’t fit the rules and were not explained anywhere, but could be understood.

Transformation is the Beast Bot power, transform into animals or gain powers related to physical body, and fir that ends it works fine, there is also material chameleon, that is similar but copying material properties, also works fine (except for interacting with some powers) but there is no “elemental body” or “alternate form” or anything similar that transform you into a single alternate form, like the Hulk, Colossus, Human Torch etc, characters that have a set of powers in their human form and have another form with another set of powers (big, green and mega strong) or a more powerful set of powers (Biler proof, can fly, etc).

The technique issue is the least of the problems as Danielle already told how it’s going to work, but the point is, the way it was written in the manuscript creates some loop holes that make you capable of infinite powers of same level as long as you have 1 tag added to the power. Danielle suggested it would become a Mega Edge that allow you get one additional power (technique) to your power array per dot in the Mega Edge, it creates a limit of 1 + quantum powers per power suit (as intended before).

Hmm, interesting in a semi-negative sort of way. My group are all MM-2e/3e vets and are very creative using that ruleset for all manner of power levels, but as with most d20 systems, step outside of the combat arena and things drop off in satisfaction. We were very pleased with Scion 2e, and the thought was to recreate our library of MU/DCU stated out for MM3e into Aberrant. Both as a learning exercise and to create a usable library of npcs. We looked at the old Aberrant rules, but given how different Scion 1E vs 2E was, we figured it was best to come at it fresh so to absorb the ruleset without any bad habits ingrained from the previous version (we had a bit of a time adjusting from Scion's 1E to 2E, so trying to learn our lesson as it were).

Several of my group like the alternate form idea with trade offs, such as Etrigan the Demon (DCU), or Legion (MU) to name a few, basically themes where the character is based on alternate forms or other similar designs. One of the go-to starter exercises usually consists of constructing Batman, Green Lantern, Wolverine and Spiderman (all with a couple of variants based on published storylines), and comparing it to other fan versions posted on boards.

But since it seems there are some significant revisions happening before release, guess we'll have to wait for it's release and give it a bit of time for a errata release (there's always one in my experience) to iron out the kinks.

If anyone has any further input or ideas of good practices, I'm very receptive and grateful for any suggestions.

[Shepherdboi]

Batman, Spider-Man, and Wolverine shouldn't be too hard to build using the kickstarter preview manuscript, but Green Lantern is likely to be difficult no matter how polished things get, since the guy can literally do almost anything.

For Batman, just building a highly competent human character with lots of appropriate cinematic yet mundane equipment, then adding one dot in each Mega-Attribute and sprinkling in some low-key Mega-Edges goes a long way towards modeling his demonstrated abilities.

[andrewm9]

Single form transformations are best handled using the dormancy edge at a rating of 4 or 5 since they will look completely different. Other options include using negative tags on the transformation to restrict it heavily.

[Shepherdboi]

Dormancy only works if one of the two forms has no powers whatsoever, and it doesn't by default cover the super form having lower attributes than the base form. Using the Hulk comics as an example, Bruce Banner has been shown to be an inventive genius capable of making literal super science devices, presumably due to low/moderate levels of Mega-Intellect.

If I had to rework Transformation, I'd have it grant a single alternate form by default, possibly with a Tag for additional forms, although it wouldn't be a simple 1-for-1 progression. Maybe the 1st Tag grants one more form (2 total), the 2nd two more (4 total), the 3rd three more (7 total), and a 4th grants unlimited alternate forms. This models how having multiple forms is more useful, but there are severe diminishing returns since you can only gain the benefit of one set of powers at a time, so getting a growing number of additional forms at each level makes up for that. Or maybe the revised Power Suite rules would be a better fit, and a Tag like that will be unnecessary.

At the first level of Transformation, I'd allow the player to strip as many dots from their character sheet as they want and use the freed up xp to buy up new traits for the alternate form. Each additional level would grant bonus xp usable only to improve the character's alternate form(s). Given that characters spend 12 xp per level of a power, the bonus xp would have to be 15+ to make up for the fact that it is only usable in their alternate form(s).

I'd also expand the range of traits that can be purchased with the power to include physical Mega-Edges, as well as Mega-Cunning, since the kickstarter manuscript claims you can use Transformation to purchase sensory Mega-Edges, and would require you to first buy Mega-Cunning to meet those prerequisites, but doesn't give you the option to buy Mega-Cunning as part of the transformation. If you don't have Mega-Cunning all the time, you can't grant super senses to your shapeshifting Werewolf.

[andrewm9]

Simply being a nova will let design stuff that is beyond normal science. Bruce Banner isn't exactly Reed Richards or Tony Stark when it comes to making gadgets, but he could also still benefit from a Superior Trait on his Intellect. The fact that he is a nova gives him access to super science dormed or not. Also Hulk isn't really dumb but he is dominated by his rage most of the time. A bad Transformation if I ever saw one. He could also have Hyde Syndrome which is similar to the way the Hulk is written. Different writes had different takes on the Hulk so you do it a number of ways.

As I said I think you can achieve what you are looking for by applying negative tags to the Transformation power. The negative tag is very subjective as there ae no hard and fast rules on them, but you could use them to restrict your transformation to a single form.

[Seeker1728]

If I had to rework Transformation, I'd have it grant a single alternate form by default, possibly with a Tag for additional forms, although it wouldn't be a simple 1-for-1 progression. Maybe the 1st Tag grants one more form (2 total), the 2nd two more (4 total), the 3rd three more (7 total), and a 4th grants unlimited alternate forms. This models how having multiple forms is more useful, but there are severe diminishing returns since you can only gain the benefit of one set of powers at a time, so getting a growing number of additional forms at each level makes up for that. Or maybe the revised Power Suite rules would be a better fit, and a Tag like that will be unnecessary.

At the first level of Transformation, I'd allow the player to strip as many dots from their character sheet as they want and use the freed up xp to buy up new traits for the alternate form. Each additional level would grant bonus xp usable only to improve the character's alternate form(s). Given that characters spend 12 xp per level of a power, the bonus xp would have to be 15+ to make up for the fact that it is only usable in their alternate form(s).

I'd also expand the range of traits that can be purchased with the power to include physical Mega-Edges, as well as Mega-Cunning, since the kickstarter manuscript claims you can use Transformation to purchase sensory Mega-Edges, and would require you to first buy Mega-Cunning to meet those prerequisites, but doesn't give you the option to buy Mega-Cunning as part of the transformation. If you don't have Mega-Cunning all the time, you can't grant super senses to your shapeshifting Werewolf.

Shepherdboi That's similar to how mechanics in some other systems of the supers genre, with some systems handling the concept more eloquently (and with a watchfulness towards abuse) than others. Again, I don't have the kickstarter rules to even begin to be able to analyze and comment, but if that is currently not allowable, your suggestion approaches things in a manner my group and I are experienced with from other systems.

Your point about being able to buy Edges dependent upon Mega-stats is a particularly spot on issue we'd have. The example of a werewolf being a very good one, since the "empowered" form is thematically supposed to have the ability that the baseline form specifically does not possess. I understand how the initial design of Edges is connected to Megas, but this does create a issue. Again, speaking without actual knowledge of the rules, if say, this is a base RAW that in order to have a Edge, you must have the Mega, and in regards to transformation based characters, I'd wind up house ruling that the baseline form would not require the Mega stat, but the transformed form would have to have it if its a prereq. Granted, there may be very good reasons why my solution opens a pandora's box of potential problems/abuses, but without the book before me, it seems like a logical and sensible approach.

So these tags it seems have a pretty significant function beyond just acting as labeling silos. Guess I'll have to just wait for the rules before I go off into speculative wildernesses. Hopefully when they come out, some of the folks here who are savvy with the system can give us some iconic character write ups for the rest of us to use as inspired examples. Personally I've been using Herosystem and Mutants&Masterminds for a very long time, and I have had many sit downs with people (or posts on forums) who are new to those systems having lots of AHA! moments from showing them how to use the various design tools in the system to better effect. A good bit of it is just learning how to translate general ideas/concepts within the system and then refining it further using the many modifiers, often in ways that aren't immediately obvious just by reading the rules.