[Aberrant] Aberrant in November

[Florin]

You could also take a specialty in strategy with Command.

I really like the specialties in TC. They make a focused character a little better at other things and reward characters with bigger skill spreads with bonuses to lots of things.

[glamourweaver]

Thanks. I have to say, at first I was baffled to see "a chess grandmaster" as an example of mental Scale. Then I remembered that you can get Scale from a skill trick, which I assume is how you'd represent grandmastery in this system. (Although I am honestly not sure which of the sixteen skills would apply to a chess match.)

So on that note, does a Scale boost from a skill trick stack with Mega-Attribute/Mega-Edge Scale? I had almost forgotten about skill tricks while reading all the crazy powers novas can get, but it does seem like a useful way to represent novas with some kind of specialized aptitude. (Like that guy with a superhuman sense of style who designs nova identities.)

I'd make "+1 Scale playing games of strategy" an Enigmas Skill Trick.


Also keep in mind that some people who are exceptional human beings in reality could be represented as Talents in the more cinematic universe of Trinity Continuum, and they also have various ways to reflect Scale between Gifts and the ability to spend Inspiration for +1 Scale as a universal power (also from the external perspective of playing chess against a Talent, you could just use Scale to reflect the Talent being so good because of dramatic editing making moves retroactively strategically correct).

[LordHeru]

I was thinking about things and I find myself wishing that I didn't actually get to see the materials of the book before they are finished and done because if the book was out I would feel so much better going "nope" and then making house rules and changes and such on the numerous elements that I find disconcerting. But because the book isn't finished there is a hope that they will decide to change certain things, even if realistically said hope is not real because they won't.

Its even more disappointing as out of all of the Trinity game lines I loved Aberrant the most.

[Mateus Luz]

While I do have some concerns related to some rules (read Super Tech, and apply it all the way to Core), my general feeling about the book is very positive. It’s a great improve over the original rules in general, you give much more flexibility on the way your character evolve and the way the game flows. The improvement is also above the original manuscript that have too many weak spot, and seams much more solid now.

For sure I will House Rule the s***t out of it, just because there is always some space to work to adapt to this or that taste (in this case, my taste). I love game rules and how we can adapt different ideas to different systems, some times without even noticing the references.

Anyway, I would love to discuss how we can improve the game for your tastes. I am trying to create the Hit Points system you suggested, I really am, but I am on a more narrative tendency than used to be, and I keep moving back to a reduced number of hit points (health boxes).

[LordHeru]

While I do agree that there have been sections cleaned up and made better/easier to read I don't think if I would personally go very positive at this time .That said they did make some changes that are pretty good, like what they did to Transcendence and Flux. The things that I would like to see improved are the Mega-Attributes, the Body Modification Mega-Edge, and the lack of mental powers in the Quantum Power suite. I totally agree with some of the weirdness in the super tech stuff but I haven't fully delved into it. The same with the quantum powers, mostly because after reading the Mega-Attribute and Mega-Edge sections I found my interest in delving into the quantum power section to have waned a bit. The truth is that it has become less fun right now so I basically just closed my copy of the book and will probably open it again later on when its more enjoyable then it is now.

On the hit point system while I won't say no, hehe, I actually get the way the health system works now, Its still not my favorite way of doing things but its okay and understandable now.

[Mateus Luz]

The Body Modification Mega Edge really is a problem on how it works, because they don’t worth the XP in general.
My approach to it is: they are “beneficial transformations”, so you consider them bought with transformations, but the transformation is the body modification itself. For example, Bioluminescence works as a epidermal shift and Wings counts as Physiological Shift.

What it means, well, it may cause some discomfort to people around you (it would anyway) what may cause increased difficulty on social interaction to people that don’t like Novas or over reaction of Nova fans. It would cause anyway, so don’t mater much anyway.

Not all Body Modifications are visual, so things like Adhesive Grip may be left alone, as well as retractable claws and hidden gills. A more visible variation of those, like Adhesive grip make your fingers look like Geko ones, or claws that are always visible, would worth a minor transformation, while Gills that cover all your chest and are particularly sensitive to people putting hands inside my worth a physiological shift.

Same can work for other Mega Edges, your body is covered in hard shell, it’s Toughness with epidermic shift transformation, or even Hardened Skin mutation (why not both?).

[Iron Seraph]

While I do have some concerns related to some rules (read Super Tech, and apply it all the way to Core),

From someone just making their way through the books (including the core) right now, would you mind expanding on this somewhat?

[Mateus Luz]

From someone just making their way through the books (including the core) right now, would you mind expanding on this somewhat?

The idea on what Supertech was build is great, the system to build it is interesting, with flaws happening spontaneously, instead of planned to make easier to build. I like it all! Even the fact you can buy a lot of items without needing the Artifact edge is a great way to make tech more available to players and justify why your car is different from everyone else.

What I think is an issue is the way it was explained in general, you must read it many times to get the intention behind it, not because it is badly written, but because it should be more technical (less descriptive) to get the details correct, maybe step by step side bar and a better use of tables would solve it.

It has a table of what a item of a certain rank can have (very useful!), and at same time it says it can’t have all, with a comment that don’t make much sense in the first reading: “The Storyguide may allow a combination of both, though the total number of dots shouldn’t exceed the Enhancement rating for that Rank.“ It seams like the number of dots of edges, not the dots of equivalent item ranks, confusing at least, what they mean, as I understand is a rank 3 item can have enhancement 4, that can be exchanged by enhancement 3 and extras rank 1, or enhancement 1 and extras rank 3 (as enhancement 2 and extras equivalent to rank 2 would be a rank 2).

The number of tags you can add to weapons, armors and vehicles is limited, below the number you get from regular items. The only advantage of an advance tech item is a lot of enhancements, what an armor don’t use (unless you treat Enhancemnt as Soft Armor, what is not described anywhere), so a advanced car that is faster is hard to built, but a easy to maneuver is easy to built. If the idea is to build an specially tough armor as an Advanced tech item, you don’t, the armor will cost more dots as a super tech item than dots in wealth to buy it.

The same issue is carried along to Aberrant, but this time with an extra, Q-Tech x Nova Tech, and a huge text about transforming one in the other (that I like) that was left over when they decided you can build a Nova tech straight from your first plan (that I also like, what may sound contradictory). There is some stuff that is going to be reviewed in the Errata, so I will not talk much about it.

Aexpansion have a better way to deal with it, with things being built as a sum of dots, with some negative characteristics counting as negative dots (different if flaws, that happen naturally). But it is designed to work only on the qualities related to psionics, not to add edges, not to add gifts, not to add enhancements when used as a tool, this kind of characteristics rely on the table described above. Scion (not in the main books, but in the companion) have a way to deal with it that is far better, similar to Aexpansion, but extending to all other characteristics, but it can’t be used because Scion have no edges, gifts or doted ranks of powers.

[Iron Seraph]

Appreciated!

I am torn on this book. It contains many ideas that I love (most of the updated setting, Collateral Damage etc) but has some problematic systems (the abovementioned Super-science, the near-nonsensical Scale chart for stuff like Mega-Brains). I feel like it needs a nontrivial patch of house rules/rewritten charts before it becomes playable.

And that makes me sad.

[Mateus Luz]

The problem of Scale is that it was intended to be open ended, and the examples don’t help at all.

The descriptions of the kinds of Scales are very interesting and gave a better understanding of their workings, but it’s not clear on how exactly they interact.
The best example is Leadership scale, I got it’s about personal power, but one example of it in use would be absolutely useful. Not a example of what have this power, one example of it in use in game by a character, for example “The President of USA commanded people to do X, as he has Leadership scale 7 due to his position, he gains this and that in the roll, or affect this many people”.
The more practical examples of scale are Power and Durability, and even them are a bit hard to explain without example “I am super strong, it don’t mean I hit more often, just that I cause more damage when I hit”. It’s a bunch of small things that would be useful to have examples.

[Zeea]

A comment on Scale on Attack and Defense:

No power cause scale on attacks or defense, except Speed and only if the target is moving, not during a close combat fight. The scales apply only to damage, and durability don’t make the targets more capable or dodging.

Mega Might can cause much more damage, but the nova can’t be particularly more capable in hitting just for being strong. The scale enhancements applies only to causing damage, including critical, what is particularly useful as you can also buy multiple injuries. So, don’t hit often, but a hit can be lethal really fast...

Pretty sure this is wrong, sorry. The example on Trinity Core page 111 has someone get a "2 Enhancement bonus to his attacks, due to his superior Scale rating in power." All of the other descriptions seem to make it clear that it's a general Enhancement bonus, not an Enhancement bonus to the Inflict Damage stunt.

If Power vs. Durability Scale only applied to damage, and you had to overcome a target's defense successes + 1 before you got that bonus, then abilities like Defense and Quantum Deflection would be a little more worthwhile. But if that's how they meant Scale to work, they forgot to write it anywhere, and the way they combine Defense and Soft Armor into one trait for antagonists mean it wouldn't work right anyway.

So, yeah, a Mega-Might 3 nova will hit a Durability Scale 1 character almost all the time.

EDIT: Also worth noting that Stamina is used to avoid physical attacks, not Dexterity. So the initial attack roll isn't really a "roll to hit" so much as "roll to overcome soak" check anyway. You _can_ get Mega-Dexterity 5 and then spend another 60 XP to get Defense 5 so you get about +2 Enhancement to your defenses, but it's not really worthwhile when you could spend 60 XP to get Toughness 5 and get about +12 Enhancement to your defenses.

Most of the game works well, but some things were either really poorly considered or really poorly explained.

[Mateus Luz]

Ok, no problem, but Spider-man will suffer a lot when fighting Rhino, unless you give him Toughness (what don’t sounds a Spider-Man thing) to represent his dodging capacity.

Also, it will be really hard to hit a tank with a paintball, or even touch it during combat.

My suggestion works fine to me. But yes, it’s a house rule.

[Zeea]

Ok, no problem, but Spider-man will suffer a lot when fighting Rhino, unless you give him Toughness (what don’t sounds a Spider-Man thing) to represent his dodging capacity.

Also, it will be really hard to hit a tank with a paintball, or even touch it during combat.

My suggestion works fine to me. But yes, it’s a house rule.

I agree. I'm just talking about the official rules here. I'd argue that Spider-Man should have some Toughness, because he has Mega-Stamina and Mega-Might and has shrugged off some pretty solid hits, but he should be mostly Defense.

I just did a house rule that makes Defense (the mega-edge) work just like Toughness and affect "Durability" Scale, except it doesn't work if you can't dodge, but also doesn't suffer certain drawbacks either.

[Queen Anne Country]

What I think is an issue is the way it was explained in general, you must read it many times to get the intention behind it, not because it is badly written, but because it should be more technical (less descriptive) to get the details correct, maybe step by step side bar and a better use of tables would solve it.

Couldn't agree more. I don't think I've ever started a thread over here but was thinking that when the final, final Aberrant comes out I'd like to start a thread that encourages people to step-by-step particularly their Q-tech. Love that the Aberrant core book has the wink-wink Battingman & Capital American & Irony Mane & Aunt-Mom gear. It feels like Mjolnir (esp the conduit to focusing Thur's powers version) would fit perfectly within the rules. However, I think I'd need a spectacular volume of hand-holding to get there.