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[Æon] Do you think Doyen reproduce?

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  • [Æon] Do you think Doyen reproduce?

    And if the don't/can't, how many of them are left after all this time?

  • #2
    They can’t, and enough for whatever story you want to tell.


    Writer. Developer. World of Darkness | Chronicles of Darkness | The Trinity Continuum

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    • #3
      What are the chances they'll be one of the races detailed in Under Alien Suns?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Bunyip View Post
        They can’t, and enough for whatever story you want to tell.
        Thank you. That would’ve been my answer too.


        “No one holds command over me. No man, no god, no Prince. Call your damn Hunt. We shall see who I drag screaming down to hell with me.” The last Ahrimane says this when Mithras calls a Blood Hunt against her.

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        • #5
          People are usher to have some aspects of the game written in stone, as it happened in VtM (WoD in general) and in Trinity Universe 1e. It was the way WW worked, with lots of mobile being launched every months for many lines, and it worked nice to people that had the money to follow.

          Trinity Continuum and CoD changed this paradigm, with a solid “year zero” and supplements expanding the setting “horizontally” or giving awesome new time frame to work with (read: TC different eras, Dark Eras and the different supplements for each line), instead of advancing the timeline.

          This creates a great Sand Box to be explored by individual storytellers and players, and don’t lock people on a rigid storyline to be able to explore some aspects of the books.

          That said, my head cannon is: the number of Doyen in the universe is in the billions, most of them just don’t care about other creatures and spend their lives trying to advance and evolve beyond their limits. The number of Doyens working with Psions is not bigger than a hundred, same for the ones working with the Chronamitcs. If you think the number of planets that the Doyen have been into over the last millions of years, the number of Doyens per planet is pretty low.


          House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
          Fists of Flux - Inspired and Powered Martial Arts for Talents
          Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Bunyip View Post
            They can’t, and enough for whatever story you want to tell.


            this just makes me want to move into the old chestnut of "genetic hybrid to keep our race alive" UFO story... but that could also be very Squicky...

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            • #7
              I like both the idea that the Doyen are a failed species in that the choices they made mean that they cannot go beyond. I also like that due to this they cannot reproduce, meaning every Doyen life is precious. I also like how they might have millions, or billions, of them and yet with how big the universe is only a few hundred to thousand are in any one particular region or project.

              Its actually humorous to me, now that I think of it, that while from humanity's perspective the Doyen are this big bad evil society destroying force but from their perspective only a few hundred Doyen actually care about humanity - and I mean that in an even knowing about us way.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by LordHeru View Post
                I like both the idea that the Doyen are a failed species in that the choices they made mean that they cannot go beyond. I also like that due to this they cannot reproduce, meaning every Doyen life is precious. I also like how they might have millions, or billions, of them and yet with how big the universe is only a few hundred to thousand are in any one particular region or project.

                Its actually humorous to me, now that I think of it, that while from humanity's perspective the Doyen are this big bad evil society destroying force but from their perspective only a few hundred Doyen actually care about humanity - and I mean that in an even knowing about us way.

                It also avoids the "planet of hats" issue. The Doyen that w'eve seen, appear to be the most bitter you can be at their failing-- they attacked Bullseye out of fear, but Creche? That was out of jealousy. More, it was out of stupid Jealousy, because You'd have to consider that even if they only have a few moments between being in our universe and ascending, a being on the verge of Godhood can probably do a lot to register its displeasure.

                The Doyen In Terra Firma, while definitely not a good guy, might be one example of this, since it's called out as possibly "going native."

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Lian View Post
                  this just makes me want to move into the old chestnut of "genetic hybrid to keep our race alive" UFO story... but that could also be very Squicky...
                  Given that the book describes the Doyen as innately paranoid, I doubt they'd even be okay with 100% Doyen test tube babies, since the descendants of those new biological Doyen would have the genetic potential to someday become more powerful than them. If they'd had any interest in such a procedure, they'd have done it a long time ago.

                  As for how many Doyen there are, it should be noted that the galaxy is incomprehensibly huge, and Doyen agents must be spread out to an absurd degree to cover all of it. And they'd definitely want to cover all of it, since their racial paranoia would practically demand it. One example of how spread out they must be is the fact that the Aberrant era happened, and they don't appear to have noticed until well after the fact.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Shepherdboi View Post
                    Given that the book describes the Doyen as innately paranoid, I doubt they'd even be okay with 100% Doyen test tube babies, since the descendants of those new biological Doyen would have the genetic potential to someday become more powerful than them. If they'd had any interest in such a procedure, they'd have done it a long time ago.

                    As for how many Doyen there are, it should be noted that the galaxy is incomprehensibly huge, and Doyen agents must be spread out to an absurd degree to cover all of it. And they'd definitely want to cover all of it, since their racial paranoia would practically demand it. One example of how spread out they must be is the fact that the Aberrant era happened, and they don't appear to have noticed until well after the fact.


                    Doesn't the current prometheus chambers contain Doyen dna or was that only in 1e?

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                    • #11
                      I can’t find any reference to Doyen DNA in the book, and it makes sense as the doyen are not made of any kind of organic matter for the last million years.

                      They probably “remember” their DNA and could build a body out of this noetic memory using biotech, but I don’t know if that’s the case.


                      House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
                      Fists of Flux - Inspired and Powered Martial Arts for Talents
                      Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Bunyip View Post
                        They can’t, and enough for whatever story you want to tell.
                        Oh, thank god. BTW, before somebody raises the inevitable "Then what is Doyen sex life?" I suggest you go ahead and call "Not It" on answering.

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                        • #13
                          Not it!

                          That said I do imagine that their 'true' form is something like the Vorlons from Babylon 5 - not in the whole being a squid like thing but them being a sort of half-matter/half-energy, half-material/half-immaterial beings that have long become beings outside of what they were, for all that it may look like it as mortal material beings.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lian View Post
                            Doesn't the current prometheus chambers contain Doyen dna or was that only in 1e?
                            Page 367 states Nihonjin researchers proved noetic biotech was made by aliens and includes alien DNA, but we don't know what species the DNA came from.

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                            • #15
                              The Corebook says the Genetic Surgery from the Promthean Chamber was made from Doyen Templates.


                              I view the Doyan as kind of like mad stagnant vampires afraid of final Death and willing to destroy the Universe if it could ensure their personal safety.


                              It is a time for great deeds!

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