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  • Sounds like a better version of the Children of Osiris discipline. I generally like this, though it might be better to give it to a similarly themed bloodline - non-Egyptian Cainites seeking to undo the curse, but not through Golconda, but by abusing what mortality they have. Just a thought.
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  • Eh, I'm sure you can find at least a few notes on several of those things. Personally I'm not a fan of the nature of blood points compared to a hunger system because the needless 'how much blood is there' comes up a lot in some of the games I've been in. I like the idea of hunger compared to a blood pool.

    That said, I do agree that discplines, metaplot, combat are bigger concerns for most and should take priority....
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  • Uh, what? VtM feeding is hardly mundane. It is inherently a semi-magical process through which one takes the life force of another through their blood. It doesn't matter if it was the 'most mundane', it isn't mundane. It isn't food and more isn't inherently better to sate the beast in said edition. Just stick to setting issues with this....
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  • For the record, that's hardly a source for the U.S. Military's stance on the comparative lethality of weapons....
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  • Some confusing statements being made here.


    So you accept there is a difference, yet the rationale you provide for why it is unprofessional to show a pre-alpha tabletop game is because they wouldn't do the same with a video game… Regardless, I think people are going to make up bogus rationale to blast having a pre-alpha. If they did this secret testing then I imagine you'd still decry it as not listening to the general public enough. I'd much prefer people are able to give their thoughts earlier on in a tabletop because I consider it a lot easier to make adjustments, even...
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  • Indeed, as Magus said, I believe the originals were all freed warriors and that other Magi wouldn't join the Sabbat until later on (and would assumedly still be under the blood curse).
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  • Monalfie
    replied to V5 Playtest.
    Alright, think we were just working with different definitions. I wouldn't draw much of a line between the two, but I see you intent.

    But as to the first part, I'm still looking for more specifics. I think 'Masquerade that isn't like Requiem' is more on point, but still doesn't entirely capture it. I guess I'll wait and see, but I haven't gotten the same idea that this new system is inherently aimed at destroying sect/clan structure in the way you suggest....
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  • Monalfie
    replied to V5 Playtest.
    Edit to what I consider relevant because there is a lot to digest there, but can you outline what these 'general desires' that can be 'deduced quite easily' in regards to 'what made it a success'? I personally can't easily see that information in the game history - there certainly is a lot of it.

    Also, I'm not sure you've made a clear distinction between collective want and consensus. But that's kind of a lesser quibble.

    I'd also note, your tone seems equally demeaning in the above paragraph. If your rational is that he went there first, so be it. But the bolded section...
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  • Monalfie
    replied to 15th generation Kindred
    Kind of besides the point. Just because it is easy to do so mechanically as a storyteller/player, doesn't mean it is a likely average character to be produced in the setting....
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  • Monalfie
    replied to 15th generation Kindred
    This is assuming they all have either the skills or disciplines to facilitate said hookups. Tom Pander, 67 year old mailman with two kids and a beer gut, might very well be a loser with no social ability and all his dots in Fortitude (no offense to mailmen or people named Tom). They aren't sexy because of the Kiss. The Kiss allows the act itself to go well (generally speaking). But it isn't what's ensuring all these encounters happen in the first place.

    I'm just not buying there are 1. a lot of 15th generation, 2. that they are all these pickup artists having lots of unprotected sex...
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  • Monalfie
    replied to 15th generation Kindred
    These are the biggest gripes I have. Even going with old numbers (1E, 2E, Revised, etc) we start with a couple weird ideas.
    -That these 15th generation have multiple partners. They might have a very fixed herd.
    -That we should be using average human fertility levels. Not sure if that is justified here.
    -What amount of 15th generation would still decide to use contraception, especially after they probably find out they got someone pregnant.
    -That 50% of them even use sex to disguise feeding as a means.
    +Relating to multiple partners, even if they use sex...
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  • Monalfie
    replied to V5 Playtest.
    Forcing players to act in a certain way based solely upon social skill checks is a surefire way to foster resentment. As was mentioned, inherently magical means both have the chance to backfire with consequences, but also let the player still feel in control of their character. It isn't them acting but magical influence. But some social rolls rob players of character autonomy in an uncomfortable way. Things like combat, magic, etc give a pretty fair idea of resolution without robbing that inherent decision making from the player.

    Note, this is mainly a discussion on the idea of 'diplomacy'...
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  • Monalfie
    replied to V5 Playtest.
    Eh, I disagree. Failure and consequences are good and appropriate. But that doesn't necessarily have to be death by any means. The risk of failing and losing a loved one can be as chilling (arguably typically more chilling) than the threat of dying.

    Not that I'm saying risking death is bad either. Just that it isn't a requirement for challenge....
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    Last edited by Monalfie; 06-09-2017, 08:57 AM.

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  • Monalfie
    replied to Potence and Flight Form
    Again, only if we're assuming Potence is adding to lifting capacity. Potence doesn't (to my knowledge) add to the carrying restrictions on the Flight discipline. So as I made note before, I don't think allowing Potence for flight form inherently creates the problem of bats flying around with people/motorcycles/etc. Just being physically able to lift something and physically fly while lifting something aren't the same....
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  • What about what they said equated to 'breaking the Masquerade'? I find this go to quite bothersome for how often people seem to employ it for essentially 'anything related to a vampire that might be negative'. If you burn a house down, kill someone, or publicly debate the mayor, that's not breaking the Masquerade. Using Presence 3 is rather subtle and Dominate 2/4 can be used to great effect without the fall guys being very aware of what is going on. Complications can exist or arise, but that's not breaking the Masquerade in and of itself.

    Also, pretty unfair and insulting to call...
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  • Monalfie
    replied to Can Gargoyles Teach Flight?
    Do Gargoyles without flight start with wings or can you go wingless? I forget if there is any related text on that.
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  • Monalfie
    replied to Potence and Flight Form
    I think a fair point (that I didn't consider) is that Flight has a certain weight limit per dot. I think a reasonable thought is that while acts of strength might be possible, actually flying while holding someone defies the demands of said magics/physics.


    I mean, I could as much as 'they're pretty big for a bat'. If proportion is the issue, I would think a bat lifting a person would be in the same vein as a wolf lifting something significantly bigger. Or a child vampire throwing a massive Vozhd if they have potence....
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    Last edited by Monalfie; 06-07-2017, 02:50 PM.

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  • Monalfie
    replied to Potence and Flight Form
    Eh, I agree it is less thematically appropriate. I just think the issue is being exaggerated. No more inappropriate than a wolf that could have enough strength to drag a car....
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  • Monalfie
    replied to Potence and Flight Form
    I mean, yes and no. You have a strength from before the embrace and one after the embrace. Technically existing as a vampire is magically driven, but that shouldn't imply their strength is all from the same type of magic as it were. One's strength, potence, blood buff, and other things work different through the blood. The idea given to me is that it is talking about inborn strength, what might be referred to as natural strength. What one's typical score is. Based on the fact that they are becoming a small creature.

    I don't think a bat lifting a person is more absurd than someone...
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  • Monalfie
    replied to Potence and Flight Form
    To me it reads that your current strength is reduced to one and that's it. The book goes out of the way to specify you can't use four specific disciplines. So it seems out of wack if we're to think Potence is meant to have limited application. Nothing of the write-up claims bat form is primarily meant for escape. There are a lot of unintentionally OP powers out there. If you think it should be limited because it'd be too strong, seems reasonable. But I defy the claim that's the intention....
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Monalfie
Monalfie
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