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  • haldir2012
    replied to Proposing a Death Sphere
    The way I'd do that is by borrowing the Dark Ages: Mage system and defining a Foundation and Pillars for each paradigm, but that is a hell of a lot of work. That is the path of "here are four or so 'spheres' that make sense for my character", so you'd probably raise the XP costs of raising Pillars because you inherently get their full value, rather than partial value out of a sphere.

    I prefer that to having the luck of the draw as for how efficient the sphere dots are for your paradigm. A "necromancer" is screwed compared to an Etherite who concentrates on...
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Nephandi
    If you want a Nephandi who wants to destroy everything but is still convincing or alluring, consider Morpheus in The Matrix. From the perspective of someone in the Matrix, he is terrible: he regularly and casually kills people and destroys buildings, and on top of that, he'll gladly explain that these are merely tools for his eventual goal of destroying the reality in which you're living.

    What if the movie was different after Neo took the red pill? What if they never actually "unplugged" and instead stayed in that reality, engaging in mass killing so they ruined the machines'...
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Proposing a Death Sphere
    Agreed that you could do all these things with default Spheres and an understanding with your ST, but it would be costly in xp. I don't like when the sphere system forces you to get a dozen dots of which you'll only use a portion. Alternate Spheres - or minor Spheres - allow those character concepts.

    I'm not particularly enamored with the numerology of Mage: nine Spheres, nine Traditions, three Essences, three layers of the Umbra, etc. So I'd call it another Sphere like any other, but that's a pretty minor detail.
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  • Mostly agree with Ramnesis.

    In theory the Spirit sphere can do all the spirit-ish stuff in whichever vidare (High, Middle, or Low Umbra) that you chose when you got the sphere, but I proposed a "Death" sphere that adds on to Low-Umbra-Spirit based on the Wraith setting:

    http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...a-death-sphere

    To my mind, awakening an obolus or other chunk of soulsteel would be Death 3, which you could also use to change their form back into a...
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  • I thought that was a hole ripped in reality at the spot where the Ravnos antediluvian died......
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Nephandi
    My two cents on Nephandi motivations:

    An inverted Avatar means that they feel satisfied, happy, accomplished, and all that when they hurt, break down, or mar something. The warm fuzzies other people get from helping, they instead get from hurting. Imagine if someone got a shock to the pleasure center of their brain - or more reasonably, an injection of heroin - when they harmed.

    On top of that, for barrabi or widderslainte who have Awakened, that inverted Avatar speaks to them. Rather than being pushed to perfection, Ascension, and self-improvement, they are pushed...
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Nephandi
    Though it's not fun to be reminded of this - Mage: the Ascension is simply a set of roleplaying books. The world it describes only exists as far as its writers wrote. If somebody asks "Hey, what was Porthos doing in the Deep Umbra after WW2?" there is no answer because nobody wrote it down and published it.

    If you think it would be cool in your game to have a specific answer to that question ("He was punching the Wyrm in the nads!" "He made Grandmother a cake made out of Forces!"), that's great, but you have to get your players to agree to fork off a...
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    Last edited by haldir2012; 09-20-2017, 04:01 PM.

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  • I think the basic answer is that the game's setting had to bow to the fact that it's a game. In the setting, interesting things happen to humans because that's necessary for the game itself to be successful.

    You can certainly come up with an answer to cover for this in-setting, but it will be just that - a band-aid to cover the issue up, rather than a true answer. So the truth of the band-aid doesn't matter, merely how well it fits.

    Personally, I'd say that humans were chosen by the Pure Ones for the same reason Lucifer and the other Elohim fell in love with them...
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Nephandi
    The difference is whether the feature they were born with actually meaningfully predicts their behavior or not. Consider Blood Brothers (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_Brothers). They had no choice in their creation, but they are little more than murder machines for their masters. It's not their fault, but they still need to be destroyed by those who seek peace. Their state not being their choice or their fault merely means their destruction is not punishment. Compare to Indian castes, where one's caste says nothing about whether you will kill hundreds of people in your life or not....
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Proposing a Death Sphere
    Death 5 would probably make for a more practical lichdom rote, where you kill yourself, stay on this side of the Shroud, bind yourself into your remains, and forge yourself a Fetter to a phylactery. Then, people can destroy your body and disembody you that way, but as long as you are Fettered to your phylactery, you'll keep coming back and embodying yourself in other bodies. Naturally, this assumes that you would keep your Avatar and Sphere magick after your conversion into a ghost...that might require fancy amounts of Spirit or Prime....
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Proposing a Death Sphere
    Yeah - it depends on whether you envision this sort of "lichdom" as simply not allowing your soul to depart after your body can no longer naturally sustain it, or if it's your ghost being placed artificially back into your remains.

    Obviously, if your lichdom rite only uses Death 3, you'll have a rough time - the body will continue to decay and eventually you'll just be a skeleton, and the moment someone manages to dispel the effect, you're toast. So you'd probably want to include Life 2 to "reanimate" your body and keep it from rotting, and some sort of Prime...
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  • If you're worried about the actual path you want to take seeming too dark or like too much of a failure, just allow for it to have been worse. The invasion of Horizon was supposed to allow the Technocracy to follow its links to the many individual horizon realms held by the Traditions and let them exterminate their Umbral presence once and for all, and instead your PCs manage to sever the links to Horizon, giving the Technocracy a Pyrrhic victory. Or perhaps the Avatar Storm would have pushed through the Gauntlet and shredded all Awakened on Earth, but for your plucky PCs somehow reinforcing...
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  • haldir2012
    started a topic Proposing a Death Sphere

    Proposing a Death Sphere

    Many folks feel that the spheres as presented do a poor job of enabling "necromancy" as they envision it. if they want to raise a corpse, they need Life 2/Prime 2; if they want to travel to the Underworld, they need Entropy 4/Spirit 3/Life 2; etc. I took a stab at creating a sphere focused on these death-related things.

    First of all - it is mostly drawn from Spirit and focused on the Low Umbra, so if you took Spirit with that vidare you'd be halfway there. It specifically doesn't include a wide philosophical definition of "death" - for example, unlike in Mage:...
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  • haldir2012
    replied to gilgul rite changed?
    Wouldn't multiple mages of the same paradigm and practice just cast it together? Much more plausible that you could get four Hermetic masters together rather than one who's mastered all four spheres.
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Technocrats taking on Verbena
    If you want to play up the depth of things the Technocrats don't understand, say that a past mage at the chantry was sacrificed to empower the Node, per the fancy Prime 3 rote the Verbena have, and that his or her presence persists in some way. The witches always know where the invaders are, the PC's minds seem foggy and unfocused, their tech goes on the fritz...

    Plus, if they win and take the Node, they can discover that the witches somehow imprinted a mental resonance on the primal energy flows in the area, and they get to "reformat" the place Ghostbusters style.
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Technocrats taking on Verbena
    If the leader has Forces 4, she can brew up a storm - or more likely heavy cloud cover - in a teapot, which would block satellite access; that might be problematic for your Technocrats.

    Is there a good reason for the witches to stay where they are? (That is, do they have a powerful Node / their world-tree / irreplaceable material possessions there?) If not, Correspondence 4 or Spirit 4 would let them walk the Paths of the Wyck and escape easily.

    You'd definitely have a lot of animated plants/animals. That's probably not a big deal given the hardsuits unless you decide...
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  • haldir2012
    replied to Fields for the Technocracy
    I'm unclear about Systems. Some of your examples imply that Systems is about higher orders of complexity - e.g., building a car would require Materials and Systems, because Materials on its own can transmute the steel struts and gasoline but can't handle an internal combustion engine. Other examples don't - e.g., you propose that Mind (or combined Data/Mind) is sufficient for all orders of complexity on mental systems.

    If you want the former case to take prominence, then Systems becomes too important. Other fields are fine for low-level stuff - e.g., Mind 2 to push an emotion into...
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  • Also, depending on the sort of guy or girl leading the local Amalgams, it could be an opportunity to demonstrate one's skills and Enlightenment (or, in Etherite parlance: "to make all those fools at the university regret my expulsion!").

    For example - I could imagine a VE leading the local Technocrats testing out his new Local Reality Anchor devices on the Hive. At several precisely calculated "Lagrange points" surrounding the Hive, Anchors are installed within a reinforced building and fed from onsite Matrices. They progressively raise the Gauntlet in an expanding...
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haldir2012
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