Healing Crippling Damage for Dummies

[The Wizard of Oz]

For sorcery, one would probably want a restoration of their body to be high Finesse. Other than that, I think the restoration of a natural limb is something that doesn't need to have too much baggage attached to the working.

I wonder if the Finesse, in this case, might relate to how weird (or rather, not-weird) the new limb is.

[Greyman]

I wonder if the Finesse, in this case, might relate to how weird (or rather, not-weird) the new limb is.

But of course it would.

[Isator Levi]

I wonder if the Finesse, in this case, might relate to how weird (or rather, not-weird) the new limb is.

I don't think it should. I think Finesse works perfectly well as being how much say you have over the precise function of your desired result expressed by difficulty of the rolls, and that something governing the aesthetic that the player gets to work with is beyond the spirit of the thing.

[Roswynn]

(That said, maybe don't go referring to even fictional people with disabilities as "a cripple," but that's beside the point.)

You shame me, Alucard. I'm sorry I used that word, I wasn't sure what term was the correct one in English and got careless... what I meant was, "playing a person/character with a disability". Meaning no disrespect to anyone.

I usually do my best to avoid offensive/disempowering language, but I failed (great SJW I am). Sorry again, folks.

[Matt the Bruins fan]

I wonder if the Finesse, in this case, might relate to how weird (or rather, not-weird) the new limb is.

What, you mean you wouldn't want to aim for a prosthetic leg composed of interlocking bronze scarab beetles that mimic human movement by tensing/relaxing their hold on each other's legs and relay commands from the wearer's nervous system to each other via barely-audible metallic chittering?

[The Wizard of Oz]

If someone did want that, and it had no mechanical benefits beyond having a leg... I'd probably let them roll at Finesse 1.

[Isator Levi]

If someone did want that, and it had no mechanical benefits beyond having a leg... I'd probably let them roll at Finesse 1.

Hmm, recalling Ambition here does help me to specify the differences between kinds of limbs; regrowing somebody's original limb is probably a lower Ambition than giving them a functional magical replacement, so there's something more substantive to it than just aesthetic tastes.

I know that, strictly speaking, Finesse 1 only says that the function of the working is in the hands of the Storyteller, so that there's technically nothing stopping them from saying "you get the exact same result as Finesse 5, without having to put the work in", but it feels like a wasted opportunity to me.

It doesn't need to be huge or anything; it could just be that the regrown limb becomes non-functional under certain uncommon conditions, as an example. I think it's better to put something in there.

[The MG]

I'd put less overtly strange replacement limbs at higher Finess, without quibbling about Ambition at all (2 seems fair). A limb is a limb – whether it was grown on a tree watered with your own blood or taken from a corpse and stitched on with garda-feather thread, there is no ambiguity in what it does, and no need for negotiation beyond the aesthetics.

Of course, if all you want is to regrow your old limb and not look like a sorcerous freak, Medicine is the way to go.

[The Wizard of Oz]

Hmm, recalling Ambition here does help me to specify the differences between kinds of limbs; regrowing somebody's original limb is probably a lower Ambition than giving them a functional magical replacement, so there's something more substantive to it than just aesthetic tastes.

Hmmm, I think it depends. Does the functional magical replacement do, mechanically, exactly the same thing? If someone comes up with a really cool idea that's going to make their character look quite iconic (and thus actually worse at pretending to be a regular person), I wouldn't like to charge them more XP for it than having a boring regular leg.

[Childofthesun1]

Dumb question. Why is it out of theme for Solars to regenerate from crippling injuries?

[TheCountAlucard]

Dumb question. Why is it out of theme for Solars to regenerate from crippling injuries?

It's a matter of degrees; there's a difference between recovering from an injury that disables your limb and recovering from it being amputated outright. The former can be an expression of a character's toughness (hence why it's a Resistance Charm), where the latter is pretty much a superpower.

[Childofthesun1]

It's a matter of degrees; there's a difference between recovering from an injury that disables your limb and recovering from it being amputated outright. The former can be an expression of a character's toughness (hence why it's a Resistance Charm), where the latter is pretty much a superpower.

Is it also a matter of degrees to shoot lasers from your sword? I've just always been confused as to how "Jump so good I can FLY" is in theme but "Be so resilient I can heal from anything" isn't. I mean, the human body can already heal back from just about anything, doubly so with Exalts. Why is growing back a limb the one thing Solars don't get to do? Because Lunars??

I mean, it doesn't even require you to break the laws of physics to grow back limbs. Lots of animals do it all the time. Some genetic splicing might let us do that someday. No way I'm ever going to survive a mountain falling on my head, though.

[Isator Levi]

Is it also a matter of degrees to shoot lasers from your sword?

That's technically an accurate representation of what Blazing Solar Bolt does, but doesn't really capture the spirit of what the Charm does, and the mythology it represents.

Personally, I would say that regrowing a limb feels a bit aesthetically incompatible with the general spirit of what Solars do; a bit of an extreme departure.

Lots of animals do it all the time. Some genetic splicing might let us do that someday.

What are you proposing by gene splicing?

[Childofthesun1]

That's technically an accurate representation of what Blazing Solar Bolt does, but doesn't really capture the spirit of what the Charm does, and the mythology it represents.

Personally, I would say that regrowing a limb feels a bit aesthetically incompatible with the general spirit of what Solars do; a bit of an extreme departure.



What are you proposing by gene splicing?

Well, we have charms that make injuries heal faster or vanish in a flash already. It's not much of a jump between "heal good" and "heal good". Block the impossible, see the invisible, but you're definitely not healing the unhealable. It just seems like such a random limitation.

As far as genetic splicing, I don't know. It's clearly beyond current science. But, animals regrow limbs. It's clearly possible within the laws of physics. Modifying how our body treats injuries or introducing a foreign agent (nanites, cybernetics, whatever) should make human limb regeneration permissible within the laws of physics.

Point being, better healing is more a raw extension of human ability that flying, perfect defenses, treating injury with a touch, the list goes on.


Also, I feel a crippled solar is absolutely antithetical to what a solar is conceptually: humanity turned to eleven. The best of the best, bar none.

[Isator Levi]

It's not much of a jump between "heal good" and "heal good".

If you reduce regrowing an entirely reduced limb entirely down to healing, then sure.

What it means for something to heal is quite nuanced, because many tissues and systems can be quite different from one another. For example, it's generally difficult to heal neurological damage, because unlike most other cells in the body, neurons do not replicate.

Block the impossible, see the invisible, but you're definitely not healing the unhealable.

There's also the question of whether or not you need to regrow a lost limb to count as having been healed. Like, you can be described as having recovered from the injury while still being a hand short.

It just seems like such a random limitation.

I'm honestly not sure if it is a limitation, but if it is, I still maintain that it's within the aesthetics.

Disagreeing is one thing, but it's a bit disingenuous to call it random if people describe the basis to you.

As far as genetic splicing, I don't know. It's clearly beyond current science. But, animals regrow limbs. It's clearly possible within the laws of physics. Modifying how our body treats injuries or introducing a foreign agent (nanites, cybernetics, whatever) should make human limb regeneration permissible within the laws of physics.

I don't know why you keep referring to laws of physics; it's another thing that is technically accurate, but not exactly relevant to this topic of discussion.

Although I suppose that even if one was focusing on physical matters, your assertion there is dubious, because it assumes a weird kind of equivalency. I mean, sure, principles of biochemical energy and structural physics make it possible for some animals to regenerate limbs. That doesn't mean that there's some kind of enshrined law of physics referring to limb regeneration, and if somebody was to crunch the numbers, they might find that the energy intensity of regenerating a human limb is a lot more severe.

It's like looking at an elephant and saying "by the laws of physics, it's clearly possible for an animal to be that big, so I see no reason why a human could not be", which ends up overlooking the physical principles dictating that something as big as an elephant would need to have about the same body structure and diet as an elephant, while something shaped like a human that was as big as an elephant would not be able to stand upright or breathe.

You say "animals regrow limbs", when it's a lot more accurate to say that some animals regrow limbs. Most of them are invertebrates, for one thing, with some significantly different structures in cell and gross anatomy.

I mean, I'm typing right now; do you have any idea the complexities in muscle, bone and nervous structure underlying the capability to do that? Regenerating a functional hand would be quite a task.

That and the sensitivity of the human genome does not exactly make it as amenable to major alterations as, say, E. coli is.

There are possibilities for human tissue regeneration, but they probably rely more on various kinds of cell stimulation provided by medical treatment. Possibly also something involving stem cells. I think that, at best, trying to genetically modify a person to do that on their own would just wind up with somebody who is extremely prone to cancer.

Point being, better healing is more a raw extension of human ability that flying, perfect defenses, treating injury with a touch, the list goes on.

Don't act as though they don't have any Resistance Charms related to healing whatsoever.

Also, I feel a crippled solar is absolutely antithetical to what a solar is conceptually: humanity turned to eleven. The best of the best, bar none.

I'm trying to think of a way to respond to this that does not constitute a violation of the rules. Because it was edited in, it's caught me by surprise; I've literally only seen it as I scrolled to the bottom of this post box.

Basically, I find your assertion that people who possess physical disabilities don't qualify for the kind of heroism that constitutes Solar Exaltation to be deeply offensive and extremely ignorant.

I don't know you well enough to speak for you, but I can certainly say that the people who take part in, say, the Paralympics are vastly superior athletes to myself. Not to mention intellectual capabilities, whether it's Franklin D. Roosevelt needing mechanical assistance to walk upright due to the ravages of polio, or Steven Hawking, one of the greatest mathematical minds and investigators into the laws of physics in history, suffering from a neurological disorder so severe that he can barely move.

These people don't qualify as among the best of the best to you?