Incest in Exalted

[The Wizard of Oz]

Dragonblooded operate by different rules as far as age goes. While celestial exaltations usually happen to adults in their prime (although, as it has been mentioned, this is not a hard restriction), terrestrials generally come into their heritage while still young (with most exaltations falling in between 10 years old and late teens, iirc)

Sure, that's fair.
Still, while it's sensible to say that Exaltation generally goes to adults, I don't see a reason to say it can never, never go to anyone younger. If someone really wants to play a child-genius Twilight, I don't see why they should be banned from doing so.
The Night caste in the game I play exalted when he was 14, which is really below real adulthood. I think it gave a good justification for why his strength and appearance have each gone up by 1 or 2 in the 2 years of game we've had since then.

My general point is that I feel the game is better served by saying "most of the time, Exaltations go to healthy people" without saying you definitely can't play someone who's disabled (or too young, or too old, or whatever). Most players are probably going to play able-bodied people anyway.
Unless 3rd ed has a really broken flaw system, of course.

[Lioness]

Most PC's are already pretty goddamned retarded anyway.

Can we not? Please.

[Astralporing]

I guess even Ledaal Kes breaks this usual rule, since IIRC he exalted at age 8.

Dragonblooded operate by different rules as far as age goes. While celestial exaltations usually happen to adults in their prime (although, as it has been mentioned, this is not a hard restriction), terrestrials generally come into their heritage while still young (with most exaltations falling in between 10 years old and late teens, iirc)

[The Wizard of Oz]

Honestly, I see no reason not to go by the advice of that 2nd ed sidebar from the Core: Exalts are usually not disabled, not too young, and not too old. But exceptions to these rules occur (Krinstett Orr, Yurgen Kaneko, I guess even Ledaal Kes breaks this usual rule, since IIRC he exalted at age 8.)

That way, most Exalts aren't suffering crippling disabilities, but if you want to have a blind swordsman, crippled genius, insane pulp sorcerer or whatever else, you can. Same with your wizened old sage who is so old that his phystical attributes are pretty poor, but has a ton of martial arts charms or spells.
I don't see that saying that it's completely impossible adds to the game, I think it detracts from the game.

[The Revenge of TV Head]

Even with Breeding, Heroic Motivation and "Moment of Emotional Passion" all being requirements, it would still be entirely unrelated to disabilities.

No shit.

I myself can't see any reason a blind, deaf or dumb person couldn't be an Exalt of any variety. One who's all THREE would be difficult. Yet..not impossible.

Edit: This attitude also applies to the mentally ill and invalid. Most PC's are already pretty goddamned retarded anyway. No reason actual mental retreads can't get in on the glowy forehead fun.

[Gallus]

This actuall made me think of a Animal Exalt who doesn't even shapeshift but can still produce beastmen sans beastiality. They have Form/Shintai like charms that allow them to take on aspects of animals as a spiritual mantle, gain the ability to wear more mantles as the rise in essence. When wearing the mantle the children they produce are beast folk, with attributes from ALL the mantles worn.

[Erinys]

That makes more sense. And if sorcerous workings get bonuses for having abilities other than Occult, that's great!

[Dusk Shine]

Craft Genesis (or the 3E equivalent)

In one comment, a writer mentioned that the non-standard Crafts (Genesis, Necrotec,...) got removed. Genesis is now a Sorcerous Working (and having Medicine helps when creating new races).

[Erinys]

Gaius, I like some of those ideas. Particularly the one of using blood to transform mortals. I do think that with Craft Genesis (or the 3E equivalent) that the Solars used to create Dune People, Tree People, People of the Air, Kyzvoi, and so forth, that making Beastfolk would be just as easy. But yeah, making Beastfolk should be significantly easier for Lunars than other Exalted. I don't care for the notion that anyone with high essence can use the bestiality method in the Wyld, but then it is the Wyld and it can turn you into a turnip with arms and legs if it wants to and you roll badly, so... maybe it makes sense? As much as anything in the Wyld can.

While I agree with your post wholeheartedly, I do feel it's worth noting that I think that for those who actually can't graduate first grade or pick their noses without a roadmap, Exaltation probably isn't in the cards no matter how many press-ups they can do.

Generally, yeah, there are going to be limits, even when demon prosthetics and shapeshifting and charms are available. Although those limits also include things that have nothing to do with disability, like having only 1 in every Virtue, or having a lifelong Motivation to be a good turnip farmer and convince your father that you aren't really that lazy after all. People with those Motivations probably don't even want to be Exalted anyway.

[Cenobite451]

[...] incapable of graduating 1st grade or picking our noses without a roadmap.

While I agree with your post wholeheartedly, I do feel it's worth noting that I think that for those who actually can't graduate first grade or pick their noses without a roadmap, Exaltation probably isn't in the cards no matter how many press-ups they can do.

[Gaius]

I think the bigger issue people are having is if Beastiality is the only native option for lunars, given how connected Lunars and Beastman have been in previous edition and continue to be in Ex3.

Well, creating beastfolk doesn't generally feel like the kind of thing it makes sense for the other Exalted we know about to have any native option at all. There's a reasonable chance Lunars will be unique* with the option of creating them via procreation.** I see it as, "This is something Lunars are uniquely able to do," not to say they must, or that it represents an overwhelming advantage they would be fools to ignore.

Sure, I presume Lunars tending to work with beastfolk can sometimes be a sign of the Lunar having sired some of their lineage. More often, though, I imagine it would be because beastfolk tend to be marginalized people, and Lunars have been described as working a lot with those on the margins of the world. "Political barbarians," using the terminology Holden provided for illustrative purposes in that big essay of his.

* Barring "And any Exalt can do it at high Essence in the Wyld!" returning.
** On top of any alternatives their Charmset gives them. If they still have that "feed someone my blood to temporarily lose a shape and transform that someone," capability, I imagine that something like "feed someone my blood to permanently lose a shape and permanently transform that someone into a composite of that shape and their original form," could make sense.

[Amine Hsu]

I recall some remarks that beastfolk could have a variety of origins. Lunar bestiality is one possibility, as is creation from a Sorcerous working. Other possibilities I presume include an enchantment on a stretch of land that causes mortal children there to be born with animal traits, mortals getting transformed by a god or raksha as a curse or blessing, or changed by the Wyld, a Spell, a working, a Charm, etc. The sense I get is that if there are differences between the results in any of these methods, they'll be generally beneath/beyond the mechanics or specific to that instance of that method.

I think the bigger issue people are having is if Beastiality is the only native option for lunars, given how connected Lunars and Beastman have been in previous edition and continue to be in Ex3.

[Gaius]

Maybe in 3E there should be other ways to make Beastfolk that are less disturbing. Or I dunno, maybe the squick is part of the point.

Aww, you're taking all the fun out of it!
(That was a joke - I don't particularily care, I'm merely curious what they're going to do with it.)

I recall some remarks that beastfolk could have a variety of origins. Lunar bestiality is one possibility, as is creation from a Sorcerous working. Other possibilities I presume include an enchantment on a stretch of land that causes mortal children there to be born with animal traits, mortals getting transformed by a god or raksha as a curse or blessing, or changed by the Wyld, a Spell, a working, a Charm, etc. The sense I get is that if there are differences between the results in any of these methods, they'll be generally beneath/beyond the mechanics or specific to that instance of that method.

[Lundgren]

Maybe in 3E there should be other ways to make Beastfolk that are less disturbing. Or I dunno, maybe the squick is part of the point.

As "Created Races" have been a thing in at least 2ed, I have always considered it possible to create Beastfolk through experimentations in a laboratory. That should probably be available to Lunars and not only Solars. Not sure creating them in a lab would be less of a squick factor, but I guess it pushes different buttons.

Then, I guess there are less "mad scientists" among the Lunars than among the Solars.

[Dusk Shine]

The game was inconsistent in how it portrayed the requirements for Terrestrial Exaltation. Sometimes it said it's 100% down to your bloodline, other times it said it required a heroic motivation as well, or it would allude to that without being explicit.

Even with Breeding, Heroic Motivation and "Moment of Emotional Passion" all being requirements, it would still be entirely unrelated to disabilities.

Maybe in 3E there should be other ways to make Beastfolk that are less disturbing. Or I dunno, maybe the squick is part of the point.

Aww, you're taking all the fun out of it!
(That was a joke - I don't particularily care, I'm merely curious what they're going to do with it.)