Question about 3E - Concerns about Sidereals, Question if any of these are changing?

[Arisano]

4. There was an explicit statement somewhere (1E Sidereals? or Compass: Yu-Shan? I forget) saying something like: the Guild slave trade is the only kind of patterned trading that works. So both Factions wholeheartedly support the slave trade and constantly harass the god of abolition with frivolous audits. That if the slave trade ever stopped the raksha would start destroying Creation, or something. This kind of setting statement, making some atrocity Objectively Right, disgusts me. I got the impression you couldn't play a Sidereal who dislikes slavery, and that the author meant that any abolitionist like Strength of Many is somehow endangering the whole world by opposing slavery.

I randomly object to this one.
Aside from that being 1E and not surfacing at 2E to my knowledge, I think you're missing the point: for an engaging story you need a conflict, and that includes moral dilemmas as well.
Quoting a certain book: "The concept of a lesser evil is an excuse for the ones lacking power to oppose both". So, it's exactly that: under the circumstances it turned out that condoning such an atrocity is the only thing keeping rakshas at bay.
That does not mean you cannot play a Sidereal who dislikes slavery - on the contrary, that would only add depth to the character. Maybe that Sidereal is a hypocrite (who said you cannot play one? It can be just as satisfying as playing a noble hero, if you do it right), maybe they accept the things grudgingly, maybe they're screwing everything up in a pursuit of a moral high ground. Or ma-aybe they've got a Motivation to get rid of the greater evil as well (solving the raksha problem more efficiently, in this case), so that the lesser one no longer has to be condoned, and they've got just enough daring to try and pull it off (or royally screw up in the process, but still that would make an entertaining game).

[Verzio]

House of Journeys
Resistance -- The Mast -- The Scripture of the Eternal Maiden
Ride -- The Messenger -- The Scripture of the Desirable Maiden
Sail -- The Captain -- The Scripture of the Maiden at Sea
Survival -- The Ship's Wheel -- The Scripture of the Maiden Entombed
Thrown -- The Gull -- The Scripture of the Maiden and Shadow

House of Serenity
Craft -- The Peacock -- The Scripture of Lover and Maiden
Dodge -- The Ewer -- The Scripture of the Hunted Maiden
Linguistics -- The Pillar -- The Scripture of the Bride
Performance -- The Musician -- The Scripture of the Dancer
Socialize -- The Lovers -- The Scripture of the Desperate Maiden

House of Battles
Archery -- The Quiver -- The Scripture of the Clay Maiden
Brawl -- The Gauntlet -- The Scripture of the Drowning Maiden
Melee -- The Spear -- The Scripture of the Maiden on the Shelf
Presence -- The Shield -- The Scripture of the One-Handed Maiden
War -- The Banner -- The Scripture of the Maiden at War

House of Secrets
Investigation -- The Key -- The Scripture of That Old Thing
Larceny -- The Guardians -- The Scripture of the Savory Maiden
Lore -- The Treasure Trove -- The Scripture of the Maiden in Terror
Occult -- The Sorcerer -- The Scripture of the Maiden in Chains
Stealth -- The Mask -- The Scripture of Absence

House of Endings
Athletics -- The Rising Smoke -- The Scripture of the Maiden and the Dust
Awareness -- The Crow - The Scripture of the Maiden and the Scythe
Bureaucracy -- The Haywain -- The Scripture of the Maiden's Promise
Integrity -- The Sword -- The Scripture of the Expectant Maiden
Medicine -- The Corpse -- The Scripture of the Maiden and the Road

[Erinys]

I was not asking for the words of the scriptures, just their names and constellations. I'm confused why this is so hard or has to be so super-secret. This stuff was in the Wiki for 2E and nobody called that a copywrite infringement.

I am absolutely not going to spend $30+ on a 1E splatbook just to find out the Ability that went with each constellation. It isn't reasonable to expect me to do that.

I am just curious about some details. And I was trying to create a horoscope randomizer tool to share with the forum, but I can't do that without even knowing which constellations exist in Ex3.

[Blaque]

To be honest, it's one of those things that will be easier to just read the text than anything. Without context, the Constellations and the Scriptures don't mean a lot. While they inform the themes of the Charms of that Ability, short of reposting nearly a thousand words of text from each Scripture, it starts to kind of bog things down and is not something that's going to be answered easily. Like, I started and foudn that by the time i was done with just Journeys I was not realy into continuing.

If you don't or have access to the list as it was before, then the changes are kind of whatever.

[Erinys]

OK but what were they in 1E? I am asking for the whole list because I don't have the splatbook. Please remember there is NO WIKI at all.

[Blaque]

On scriptures (which is what the Ablities used, not sutras which were for SMA), they are mostly as in 1e, with the following changes:

Resistance is the Mast (merged with Endurance in Journeys) and still the Scripture of the Eternal Maiden.

Presence is the Shield (due to War taking the Banner in 3e and Resistance moving ot Journeys) and is the Scripture One-Handed Maiden.

War is the Banner (which is taken-up from Presence) and the Scripture of the Maiden at War.

Integrity is the Sword and the Maiden in Waiting. It's interpretted this edition as bieng kind of an executioner's sword.

As noted, Martial Arts are uniersally favored for Sidereals, and we'll even getting the other Bureau styles in the Companion.

[TomDick&Harry]

Journey's Caste Abilities are Resistance, Ride, Sail, Survival & Thrown.
Serenity's are Craft, Dodge, Linguistics, Performance & Socialise.
Battle's are Archery, Brawl, Melee, Presence & War.
Secret's are Investigation, Larceny, Lore, Occult & Stealth.
Ending's are Athletics, Awareness, Bureaucracy, Integrity & Medicine.

And then they all get Martial Arts as a Caste Ability on top of that.

[Erinys]

Thanks you two.

Another question I have is what Abilities does each Caste favor now? And which constellation and sutra goes with each Ability?

[Blaque]

Kind of notable, Exalted 3e is fine with some spirits just not fitting in the main four category of god, elemental, demon, ghost. It appears in this case, pattern spiders are just kind of a unique spirit that doesn't really fit in the broader taxonomy.

[Verzio]

So, there are no longer situations like some guy dying but still being alive whom you have to go assassinate?

Does Charting Fate's Course say Pattern Spiders aren't gods?

Implicitly. It says "Heaven is known as the city of the gods, and they comprise its substantial majority, but aren’t its sole inhabitants. Its populace includes . . . unique spirits like the pattern spiders[.]" And later "Destiny is planned by heavenly committees, and it isn't self-fulfilling, requiring the intervention of pattern spiders, gods, and Sidereals to make sure it’s fulfilled."

Exactly what the distinction means is not particularly obvious to me.

[Erinys]

So, there are no longer situations like some guy dying but still being alive whom you have to go assassinate?

Though I don't think Pattern Spiders are considered gods anymore and if that's the case they can't technically use the Exigence.

Does Charting Fate's Course say Pattern Spiders aren't gods?

[Isator Levi]

That's the other thing, that "snarls" in fate aren't really a part of the setting anymore, whether they come from Essence-users or not. The Sidereals are not charged with locating instances in which causality broke down as a matter of course. I feel as though that concept has been largely consolidated into the point that if a destiny is defined but fails to come to pass, that makes the Wyld more likely to break in.

Possibly one might also see some of the idea in the way that Third Edition's take on the setting is a bit weirder, more likely to include inexplicable oddities, it's just that if such things are deviations from fate then they're part of the established standards of what does so (shadowlands, Wyld zones, demonic appearances) rather than Creation being a bit flimsy. It may be that some such occurrences frustrate Sidereals and they feel a need to act to contain them, but it's not as if other things that are perfectly in keeping with fate such as the Exalted, the gods, or even sometimes the whims or mortals are never equally frustrating.

So the key thing is that no, a Solar just being a Solar is in no way presented as something that risks breaking down reality just because. It's rather that the actions they can take with such capabilities can threaten to derail destiny, the plans of Heaven, and that is something that can cause some bad things to happen.

But as was said, Yu-Shan generally accounts for that by trying to have destinies that the likes of the Exalted won't interfere with, as well as occasionally deploying the Sidereals themselves to try and prevent such interference.

It helps to know what the Exalted are capable of and why they do what they do, which is why Lytek is still an incredibly important god even though he categorically has nothing to do with their actual Essences anymore. His is the job of documenting the lives and deeds and personalities of all Exalted, which is very useful to anybody who wants to plan destiny around them.

[Blaque]

The Loom as noted doeesn't dicate Fate or is the machine that runs causality. Creation does that on its own and the Loom is more something that allows forecasts of where fate is going and allows the pattern spiders through it to manipulate probability for minor tweaks.

The big thing is that Essence users are super unpredictable and unreliable and tend to get into contact with enemies of fate, so destinies typically are planned that don't depend on them intervening as that's just putting less strain on your own job.

[Erinys]

So... did they keep the idea that any Essence channeling causes snarls in the Loom? I really hoped they would dump that because it never made any sense.

[Isator Levi]

I think the Conventions this time around have a much stronger foundation in the general business of Heaven concerned with destiny and the extent to which expertise about cultures and environments is necessary to make it work.

Also, the Convention of the East is actually consistent about the idea that lots of Exalted out that way makes destiny harder rather than being "this helps, actually, despite what earlier sections of the book said".