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Mental Stability of newly Exalted Solars?

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  • #91
    Again, it's the difference in presentation, between keeping something as a background detail and instead choosing to shine a spotlight on it.

    "The Solars went crazy and did things." Okay, what kind of things? Who knows. They don't really matter during the 2nd Age and the actual details of what the Solars did are kind of irrelevant at this point in time. All that matters is that the Great Curse was insidious and subtly pushing the Solars to become BBEGs who threatened to destroy the world. And it's important to remember that the Solars weren't necessarily BBEG's at that time. Just that the Prophecy showed that they all would become BBEGs in the future, and destroy Creation unless they were "dealt with."

    In contrast, the Sidereal Exalted's decision to choose the Bronze Vision over the Gold Vision is incredibly important to the current setting of the gameline (it's a major plot point for Sidereal PC's), and for the game to say that decision was the result of the Great Curse puts the Great Curse in the spotlight on the Great Curse way that's bad for the game.

    This isn't only true of the Great Curse but many other facets of the game as well. Some things are okay if they're left in the background and not really explored very much. It's fine to make a note that mortals in Malfeas face terrible abuse at the hands of demons there, and perhaps make dry listing of some of the terrible fates that await them. But it's completely different when the gameline begins giving that specific focus, detailing at length the abuses that a specific human in Malfeas (Lilun) faces.

    Essentially, the Great Curse as a background detail and character flaw is acceptable, and it's acceptable as a vague excuse for why "sometimes bad stuff happened," but the moment the gameline begins using it as a "cause and effect" reason for why specific events unfolded in the way that they did, that's where it's an issue and being used in a hamfisted manner - especially for something like the Gold vs Bronze prophecy, which is supposed to have some feeling of nuance.

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    • #92
      Originally posted by Totentanz View Post

      Saying the Great Curse is the reason the Sids went Bronze is bad.
      Saying the Great Curse is the reason the Solars went bad is good.
      The thing is, despite their similar phrasing these two concepts are actually very different beasts.

      Following the prophecy of bronze was one very specific decision. That's not how the Great Curse works. It didn't deliberately steer the solars to particular atrocities, it just sent them mad and let them express that madness however they wished. It's a state of being, not a driving force.

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      • #93
        I wonder if there is a way to use Arcane Fate/Broken Mask to take the spotlight off the Great Curse's part in the Usurpation.

        All the Sidereals who survived the Usurpation wake up in the Loom of Fate with no recollection of what has happened over the past year. They go about their day and realize two things: one, the Dragonblooded overthrew the Solars and two, no one remembers anything about who they are and what Sidereals are. The Sidereals look up in the sky and see the remains of the Broken Mask and figure they did something. While the Sidereals and rest of the Bureau of Destiny know who they are, no one can account for the Sidereals activities over the past year. After years of divine audits and hearings, the only charge the courts can make stick is "Destroying Evidence."

        The Assumption is that Sidereals decided to get involved in the Usurpation (not sure if they recruited the Dragonblooded or the Dragonblooded recruited them). To cover up their involvement, they casts some major Astrology that went bad and left them with Arcane Fate. If a Great Prophecy was cast, no one remembers.





        I write things.

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        • #94
          Originally posted by Elfive View Post
          The thing is, despite their similar phrasing these two concepts are actually very different beasts.

          Following the prophecy of bronze was one very specific decision. That's not how the Great Curse works. It didn't deliberately steer the solars to particular atrocities, it just sent them mad and let them express that madness however they wished. It's a state of being, not a driving force.
          This.
          One thing DotFA did really right was the Hierophant's relationship with the Great Curse Heart of Tears didn't make him commit atrocities but he recognised that other people suffering made him depressed so he stopped putting himself in situations where he was likely to encounter it and thus becomes blind to the atrocities of his peers.


          Sword of Creation a hub for Exalted related content

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          • #95
            Originally posted by Totentanz View Post

            Right, you're slicing that mighty thin.

            Saying the Great Curse is the reason the Sids went Bronze is bad.
            Saying the Great Curse is the reason the Solars went bad is good.
            I think it's bad if taken as a strong reason, if it's functionally as a bait and switch from what we know about the Usurpation, and bad with the Sidereal Curse in its current form (hubris).

            It wouldn't be so bad if all we knew from the very start of the game was "The Curse ate away at the hearts of the Exalted, leading them to passions, folly and war, and the Solars, the greatest, were ultimately the most diminished, and cast asunder". That would be "Unity of presentation".

            If the Great Prophecy had never been set up as a resonant choice, and the Usurpation never as a struggle against tyranny. (I'd probably be like 75% okay with that as an alternative thing.)

            But if we're in the position of the setting is taking the choice of the Great Prophecy as a choice between a more glorious or a safer world seriously, then yes, it is bad to undermine that by bait and switch making the choice of the Paths of Bronze and Golds due to the Great Curse. Even if "unity of presentation".

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