[2E] Anti-Scions Weapons

[wyrdhamster]

So I want to explore idea of 'Scions hunters' enemy organisation in my game. Got some previous research and uncover that all Scions in the World are having physical mark of their Scionhood as Ichor in their veins. So weapon that negate Ichor - Anti-Ichor - would negate their powers. I would suspect it would negate Legend points up with each hit, too lowering Legend to 0 - and by this, making Scion into mortal again. More on Anti-Ichor later today then. 😎

[Nicolas Milioni]

Do you accept criticism? I don't wanna sound mean

[wyrdhamster]

Do you accept criticism? I don't wanna sound mean

I literally have now post-COVID breathlessness attack, just right now. ( On general, not on the criticism – but my health is not so good lately. ) If you do not like topic idea on fundamental level – just leave this topic, for both of us comfort.

Right, now that those who are generally behind the concept remained - let's move on to the rules. New weapons tag,,,

Anti-Ichor ( Legend Drain )

This weapon is made to fight with Scions. Made by foul magic or advanced technology, is dedicated in attacking godly Ichor in veins of Scions. Each hit by this weapon spend Legend point in the target. When target is lowered to Legend 0 by this, Scion loose access to Purviews and other magic and Immortal Knacks – but not Heroic Knacks. Target can still use Relics that do not need the spending of Legend, like Origin Scions can. Regaining Legend lost by hit with weapon requires the close contact with Purviews sources for one hour, at least one for each Legend point. Scion with Sky Purview need to glide in the sky, holder of Fortune Purview need to go to casino, etc.

Any constructive criticism on Weapons Tag?

[Aristarkos]

This is exactly what the Aggravated Tag is for, you could use that instead.

[Mateus Luz]

A weapon to drain Legend is pretty strong, as they don’t have that many Legend points and it don’t refill itself automatically. It is possible but it would be a 4+ tag cost.

[Astromancer]

Meteoric Iron has been a traditional bane to many types of supernatural creatures. And as meteorites fall all over the Earth highly similar, but fully distinctive, myths have formed worldwide involving such. Why not have "star metal swords" as a Scion bane?

Heck, they still make a type of ceremonial dagger/sword on Java from the metal of an ancient meteorite. That's not folklore, I saw it in a documentary that ran on PBS in the late 70s!

[wyrdhamster]

This is exactly what the Aggravated Tag is for, you could use that instead.

Where Aggravated Tag is draining Legend? 🤥 I need to re-read this Tag from Origin book. Be right back...

[notMidas]

I like it. I would use it sparingly as a big nasty, cost it at 5 dots for a relic.

I would call it 'legend drain', so it could be used on legendary beings as well as scions.

[Dataweaver]

It sounds something that might fit in Masks of Mythos.

[Florin]

To extrapolate a little more, any weapon which drains Legend is dangerous to Heros, Demigods, and Gods. I can't imagine anything which would unite the pantheons like a weapon capable of wiping them out. That would be a setting consideration to take into account.

[Aristarkos]

Where Aggravated Tag is draining Legend? 🤥 I need to re-read this Tag from Origin book. Be right back...

It doesn't drain Legend but it does represent well foul magic and causes grievous wounds that that cannot be easily healed or restored and also bypasses armor completely (or at least I think so... I haven't got the books with me right now).

Furthermore, the Injury Conditions that such weapons inflict on a Scion can be used to inflict penalties to Scion-specific abilities which mirror quite well the effects of draining Legend I think.

[wyrdhamster]

I'm preparing my Scion Hunters enemies for PCs, so made this Anti-Ichor Rifles - What do you think about them? Based on Hunting Rifles from Divine Armory community product:

Anti-Ichor Rifle – Enhancement 2, Aggravated – Tags: Firearm (2), Anti-Ichor ( Legend Drain, 5 ), Lethal (0), Loud (-1), Piercing (2), Ranged (0), Two-Handed (-1)

[nalak42]

An important question, the bit on making a Scion mortal again. First, I presume this is a temporary state ie the explanation for regaining Legend will still work and not, "Well that last hit reduced your legend to 0, so you lose all your Scion stuff and your character is baseline human again permanently."

The second bit, reducing an entity to 0 legend in this way would work how mechanically if we're saying it makes them mortal? Like obviously can't use powers that require Legend. Do they keep all the viable knacks they had slotted when they were reduced to L0 or must they "unbuild" back to Origin?

[Mockery]

So this is something I would never include in a canonical book: I feel like anti-divine weaponry--or really any meaningful ability for mortals to take arms against the gods without engaging them on their own context--is kind of antithetical to the default game. Further, this is akin to the Reclamation of Exalted 2e: something that, once included, becomes fairly central and difficult to ignore.

That said, far be it from me to say that something is an objectively bad idea. I toyed with similar ideas myself before. I do, however, think that this is a plot hook that requires more than a weapon tag: it's a weapon that--despite whatever narrative spin is placed on its origins--enforces the axiom that myth at its most truthful is fanciful exaggeration, that strips stories of power and makes humans of heroes.

Mechanically, does this also deal its inflict damage stunt along with emptying the Scion's Legend Reserves?

Also, your tags include both Aggravated (Right after the Enhancement Bonus) and Lethal. I imagine you only mean one of those, so I'd recommend Lethal. I'd be *tremendously* leery of tacking Aggravated Damage onto something that significantly negates armor and also strips the characters of their abilities; not only does it tend to reflect horrifying bodily harm that the weapons don't necessarily imply by themselves, Aggravated Damage requires supernatural healing in Storypath and if you're inflicting that on a Healer with the same dice roll you're hindering their ability to recover from it, that's kind of a big thing.

Narratively: is this kind of weaponry something you think would eventually be aimed at Gods? Do you intend that it should be a concern to them? I kind of feel like a demigod or god defeated by one of these weapons--their veins filled more (or entirely) with ichor--would feel the effects differently from a Hero. Off the cuff without system analysis, I would say something like a Demigod automatically suffering a failure deed for having their Legend wholly negated, while a God would suffer something even more enduring: maybe one of their titles is lessened (a la the penalty for failing the Second Calling from the Demigod preview), or perhaps their ability to manifest in the world or perform feats of scale is impacted in some fashion.

[wyrdhamster]

Mechanically, does this also deal its inflict damage stunt along with emptying the Scion's Legend Reserves?

Yes, being hit by Anti-Ichor would both lower (temporary) Legend and make Injury on target.

Also, your tags include both Aggravated (Right after the Enhancement Bonus) and Lethal

Yeah, I meant only Lethal here. Will edit in newer version of rifle.

Narratively: is this kind of weaponry something you think would eventually be aimed at Gods?

As I mentioned many times, I run on ‘Gods in Hiding’ setting hack / Iron/Heroic Myth level games – i.e. Gods in my games are rare and ‘in hiding’. I suspect someone could use Anti-Ichor on god Incarnation, but it would be very rare situation. Even there – I will take your advises in my mind.

Second take on the Anti-Ichor rifle…
Anti-Ichor Rifle (v0.2) – Enhancement 2– Tags: Firearm (2), Anti-Ichor ( Legend Drain, 5 ), Lethal (0), Loud (-1), Piercing (2), Ranged (0), Two-Handed (-1)