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  • #31
    This post is going to be edited a few times to add Paths. I'm doing them from scratch because the Sorcerer book's Paths were always mechanically odd.

    Path of Healing:

    Dice Pool: Path of Healing + Medicine (or Alternative)

    Modifiers: +1 difficulty on unwilling target, +2 difficulty on supernaturals the user hasn't studied and practised on.

    Wounds:

    The number of points of damage healed. Speeding the natural healing processes reduces the difficulty by 2 and simply divides the healing time by the level being used.

    So if you cast to heal 5 points of damage, that's a difficulty 8 roll and you need to be at level 5 in the Path. If you want to help someone who's taken 5 points of damage to slowly recover, the difficulty is 6 and you take the healing time down to one fifth.

    Toxins:

    Any diseases or poisons you're trying to heal. Refer to the Toxins system in M20. Successes must be accumulated which match the level of the toxin being overcome.

    If you seek to cure someone of a level 5 toxin, it's a difficulty 8 roll and you must accumulate 5 successes.

    1: Cold (B) Alcohol (B), THC (B)
    2: Chicken Pox (B), Food Poisoning (B), MRSA (L) Methamphetamine (B), Methanol (L)
    3: Influenza (B), Cancer, Early (L), Pneumonia (L) Ptomaine (B), Tainted Water (B), Tear Gas (cloud; B), Belladonna (L)
    4: HIV (L), Leprosy (L), Cancer, Advanced (L) Salmonella (B), Ammonia (L), Fouled Water (B)
    5: Severe Flu (B/L), Cholera (B), Cancer, Extensive (L) Bleach (L), Industrial Waste (L)
    6: Bubonic Plague (L), Anthrax (L) Strong Acids (L) Ebola (L) Sarin (L), Cyanide (L), Acidic Sludge (L)

    Coulored Side-Bar: "Wait, my starting character can cure cancer?"

    Yes, genius, your character can cure cancer. They can also save 10 children from blindness by donating £10 to a River Blindness charity once a week, but do they? Some Sorcerers go on road trips to save as many cancer patients as they can when they first develop the Path of Healing, but they inevitably burn out or attract the wrong sort of attention. Yes, it's possible for a Master of this Path to heal a person with late-stage brain cancer with a click of their fingers, but there's a good reason many who can don't. There are entire societies devoted to keeping people in line on the whole "magic isn't real" thing, and your Gaze of Miracles is going to get you bad attention from the Camarilla or Technocracy if you get too showy.

    Range:

    The distance you're casting from (must be in line of sight).

    1: Touch Only
    2: Within 10 feet
    3: Within 25 feet
    4: Within 50 feet
    5: Within 150 feet
    6: Line of Sight

    Targets:

    Those who benefit from an effect. There must be a Sympathetic link between a group of targets, be it a common disease, a social or political affiliation, a shared uniform...

    1-3: A single target
    4: Two Targets
    5: Three Targets
    6: The entire Sympathetically linked group, no more than 15.

    Side-Bar: That Which Heals...

    Can the Path of Healing be used to kill? It seems rather logical that a power which can close a wound could open one, or that a power which can lessen the effects of an infection can worsen them. However, this is not the case with this Path. The Mythic Thread upon which the Path of Healing is founded works towards a Platonic Ideal of human health. It removes things which detract from health, rather than manipulating the flesh through some kind of psychic surgery. With that said, a cancer is sufficiently Othered from the form of a human that (at storyteller discretion) a practitioner can "heal" the cancer, helping it recover from any wounds inflicted upon it by the immune system or surgery, or any toxins cast upon it by chemotherapy or radiotherapy. This is an extremely niche, pernicious and cruel application of the Path, and for most practitioners it is entirely hypothetical.

    Path of Destruction:

    Dice Pool: Path of Destruction + Occult

    This Path allows a Sorcerer to generate a dangerous force to attack others with. The force must originate at the caster and be directed towards its target in some fashion. Targeting is performed through a Dexterity + Athletics/Brawl roll; throwing a javelin of electricity, throwing a fireball, unleashing a flaming punch. On a Botch the Sorcerer targets themselves (and the surrounding Area if using that Aspect) and suffers the full effects of the spell.

    It is easiest to imagine this Path as though each attack were a weapon. The targeting roll is like trying to hit someone with a sword or a gun, and the spell simply has a damage modifier and a type of damage associated with it. The Dexterity + Athletics/Brawl roll determines if the magical attack hits, and this is followed by a damage step. Like normal weapons, "excess" successes from hitting carry over to damage. If the targeting is done through a simple grab, then no excess damage is applied. This Path is explosive and combative; punches, throws, scratches and bites are acceptable delivery for extra damage but a ginger touch is not.

    Note: Mana expenditure effects the roll to summon up the attack, and does not reduce the difficulty of targeting it, or the difficulty of the damage roll.

    Modifiers: +/-1 if the area is opposed to or aligned with the attack. A fiery attack on a scorching hot day would be at -1 difficulty, a fiery attack during a rainstorm would be +1 difficulty.

    Damage:

    The amount, and type of damage being done.

    1: 3 dice of lethal damage
    2: 5 dice of lethal damage
    3: 7 dice of lethal damage [Note: Equivalent to someone with Strength 5 attacking with a Sword]
    4: 7 dice of aggravated damage
    5: 10 dice of aggravated damage
    6: 10 dice of aggravated damage + 2 unsoakable points of aggravated damage

    Penetration:

    How effectively it overcomes the target's defenses:

    1-3: Soak is difficulty 6
    4: Soak is difficulty 7
    5: Soak is difficulty 8
    6: Soak is difficulty 9

    Range:

    1: Touch
    2: Within 10 feet
    3: Within 25 feet
    4: Within 50 feet
    5: Within 150 feet
    6: Line of Sight

    Area:

    1-4: A single target.
    5: Roughly 5 square feet.
    6: Roughly 15 square feet

    Side-Bar: "I blow up the Vampire's Haven"

    Yes, this Path does give a user (particularly a more advanced one) the ability to perform some wonderful acts of arson. A blink of your eyes can turn that pesky witch-hunter into electrified ash, and a flick of your wrist can freeze that bothersome man from the IRS. However, Actions tend to have Consequences, and a player who solves every problem with a bolt of Aggravated Alternating Current will quickly find themselves without allies, stuck in a situation which you can't throw fire at. Storytellers, remember that arson, murder and strange occurrences will draw the ire of other supernaturals and the authorities, and in extreme cases remember that an angry Prince or Technocracy director, or a particularly skilled Hunter, can simply arrange for a bullet to be placed in the back of a trigger-happy warlock's head from 500 feet away.

    Side-Bar: "So I'm going to use a lightning bolt to charge my phone..."

    This Path's mystic thread is the very act of destruction, unweaving and breaking. Mastery over frost might let you freeze food, mastery over fire might let you cook, mastery over lightning might let you charge a phone... however this Path grants the user mastery over destruction. Any act where the primary goal is not breaking or destroying something will not fit within the framework of this Path. At storyteller discretion a player may learn a Path which is devoted to a specific element (Fire, Lightning, Decay, Frost etc.) and this Path will grant such benefits (making water into ice to stand on or cooling drinks for Frost, making beautiful crackling sparks for guests or charging a projector with Lightning), as well as the normal Destructive effect. The tradeoff here is that they can only harness that element and are therefore less flexible.

    Path of Mana Manipulation

    Dice Pool: Path of Mana Manipulation + Awareness

    This Path deals with the flow of supernatural energy. It can redirect, convert, rebalance and absorb energy in precise and limited ways. Using this Path a Sorcerer might perceive Vampires as glowing red and humming with sanguine energy, or they could catch the scent of another sorcerer's work. They might undo a ritual by draining its power, or turn blood into mana. They might shield themself from a Mage's fireball, or even absorb it... Let us begin.

    All energy is related to Mana. Is Mana the purest form? Is Quintessence? Is Glamour? Is Vitae? How does one compare the power of the blood of Caine to the magical energies which flowed through the oldest Archmages? How does one compare the energies wielded by a Queen among the Fae to that conveyed by a paragon of Sorcery? In the end, these questions have little bearing on the Path. They're all related... somehow, and this Path can manipulate that connection.

    The Path is too precise to be placed into Aspects, and therefore will be split into Spells.

    1: Sense Mana. The user can, on a successful roll, perceive Mana. If a person has a blood, mana, glamour, gnosis, quintessence (etc.) pool then they will appear unusual under this sight. The User cannot simply understand the difference between a Werewolf and a Vampire using this power, but if they can learn to attribute specific visual cues with specific supernaturals if given accurate information. This power does not allow the Sorcerer to perceive things they could not perceive normally, such as beings in the Umbra and Vampires using Obfuscate.

    2: Perceive Mana Flow. The user can now see how Mana is being used. A Ward will be visible, as will an object which has been enchanted. If an object has been effected by a supernatural power, it is visibly different under this sight. While observing a supernatural or an object under this power the user may roll Intelligence + Occult (difficulty determined by Storyteller) to attempt to understand what they are seeing. Understanding a Vampire might be a difficulty 5 roll (before you stands a dead body which drinks blood to survive and fuel its supernatural powers), while understanding a Thaumaturgical ritual might be a difficulty 8 roll (the stake in his hand has been endowed with its own energy and can move of its own accord).

    3: Sap Mana. The user can wastefully steal mana from a person or object by touch. The stolen mana is lost and dissipates into the aether. Each success removes a point from the targeted supernaturals' power source (one success is one point). A ranged version of this effect increases the difficulty by 2. If an object or effect is targeted, then 1 of the successes in its creation is removed for every 3 successes on the Mana roll. At Storyteller's discretion, Level 6 and higher objects/effects may be impervious to this effect.

    4: Mana Conversion. The user's Mana pool now increases by 1 for every dot they have in Path of Mana Manipulation. Furthermore, they can roll to convert one kind of magical energy into Mana, or visa versa. Through this method a Sorcerer can steal mana from the bodies of animals, people, and Supernaturals. Finally, the Sorcerer gains a Counter-magic effect. When targeted by a supernatural power that they can perceive, they may roll a level 4 Path of Mana Manipulation effect to soak it, but this costs 3 mana per use, and the difficulty of this roll cannot be reduced by further mana expenditure.

    5: Mana Transduction. By changing the local Mana to suit their magical style, a Sorcerer can reduce all Sorcery roll difficulties by 1 for 1 hour per success. They may also absorb Mana from their surroundings at a rate of 1 dot per hour on a successful roll. Lastly, they can perform a Mana block. The targeted creature (touch only) cannot spend any supernatural power resource for 1 turn per success.

    6: Mana Mastery. The Sorcerer automatically regains 1 point of Mana every 30 minutes unless interference is deliberately put in place through mystical means. They can pour Mana into others at will and they can store mana in objects. Lastly, they may spend Mana to gain automatic successes (maximum of 3) on Sorcery rolls. If they do not already possess them, they gain the Flow of Ki merits for Social, Physical and Mental rolls.
    Last edited by 11twiggins; 04-14-2017, 01:49 PM.

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    • #32
      Why was divination, the only Hedge magic in project Twilight? ideas


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      • #33
        Probably because Project Twilight is about the US intelligence community's efforts to investigate the supernatural.


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        • #34
          I think I will go into Kinfolk next. Here we see one major issue in that a lot of cross potential gets wasted on 'where do we put it?' as magic and psychic abilities are redundant with many other facets, and including them would require multiple sourcebooks or a much higher page count.

          One one hand, the various Breeds have a distinct distrust of 'others' that comes along with fighting a loosing war. On the other hand, they ARE loosing and it makes available tools all the more tempting. In the case of Sorcerers and Psychics, the line between a gifted Kin and a Gifted Kin can be blurry, and sometimes likely changed from character to character without much warning. Is the Human Kin that talks to his wolf family (who he may actually be related to by blood!) an aberration using Animal Psi, just an oddity (Merit?), or did a CoG Galliard teach him Beast Speech to help keep local humans and and wolves from encroaching on each other as best as possible?

          In a less personal note, you also have differences in tribal takes. The Get of Fenris had a long war with a Necromancer, and the Silver Fangs might not see much difference between human ritual magic and Baba Yaga's that kept the Curtain up for a long while.

          On the other hand, it doesn't make much sense for Changing Breeds to personally learn the magics that many sources support, but in some ways makes much more sense that those that curry such secrets to keep them alive with their Kin, who would be most trusted. (So long as they remember their true allegiances.) Bubasti and Uktena really kind of fell down on that, while the Mokole made it a footnote. (With the destruction of the Hem-Ka Sobek, I could see them picking up the remnants.) Each of these (and the Shadow Lords) I could see maintaining a Society/Fellowship.

          From the direction of Black Spiral Dancer (and other fallen) kin, I could even see a resurgence of the Enlightened Society of the Weeping Moon, along with their own proprietary pair of Saturnal Paths. (Though they could be covered with Divination, Ephemeric Summoning, and Necromantic Summoning.) Certainly there would be room for Infernalism.

          This would also reflect in Resonance, and it's importance for Kin and their relationship with their Breed, in some ways potentially more important than in a Mage setting. And the reflection of Wyrm/Weaver/Wyld from their point of view deserves exploration.

          Revised seemed to drop the difficulty break for dealing with spirits (-2 Dif on Ephemera Path). I'd personally leave that there. But I would clarify that it requires Breed intervention to learn Gifts. The Pact may have some leeway for Kin, but Gifts are still the domain of the Trueborn. However, attempting to learn a Gift could instead unlock a Psychic path, or potentially allow greater understanding of their own Ritual magics.

          Of course, Formori Brotherhoods also come to mind, though I see these as being volitile and short lived. (Much like Weeping Moon.)

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          • #35
            Hmmmn curious question?

            WTA DOES NOT use Humanity.

            Think the Path of Cursing still works for a kinfolk? who wants to be vindictive and use voodoo dolls etc?


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            • #36
              MtA doesn't use Humanity either.


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              • #37
                Originally posted by Prince of the Night View Post
                Hmmmn curious question?

                WTA DOES NOT use Humanity.

                Think the Path of Cursing still works for a kinfolk? who wants to be vindictive and use voodoo dolls etc?
                Humanity is definitely a 'Vampire' thing. It's about staving off the Beast just a little longer. It's also a good hunter thing, as they fight off the urge to become worse than what they hunt.

                For Werewolf (or Mage), it's a bit of a useless point sink, if there isn't an actual story to tell around it.

                Not exactly sure why you brought that up?


                As for what magical Paths they can learn, it's as open as anyone else. Possibly more so, as in effect, the Skin Dancers (which I probably should have mentioned in my last post) were formed by a rogue Kinfolk that was gobbling up whatever magic he could find, and the BSDs basically created their own secret society that utilized Paths they helped create from their own Rites. (Wyld West)

                Of course, the cost would have to be weighed. As I said, Resonance is going to be big deal at family gatherings. If the kin is focused on Cursing and Hellfire, might start to smell a bit on the Tainted side if he's not careful.

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                • #38
                  Now, it is perfectly fine to add Humanity/Virtues to a crossover game, but you have to decide what the exact mechanics you want to associate with them. I generally give my players a reason to purchase Humanity and Virtue beyond their base level. In the case of Mages, I allow Humanity to serve as a buffer for Paradox (Mages can absorb up to their Humanity in Paradox before they start to suffer Backlash and, as long as their Paradox is less than their Humanity, they lose one point of temporary Paradox per day). In the case of Fera, I allow Humanity to serve as a check on Rage (Fera do not suffer from the Curse or have to check for frenzy, except when spending Rage, as long as their temporary Rage is less than their Humanity). Of course, every ST will treat their crossovers differently.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by EvilTyger View Post

                    Humanity is definitely a 'Vampire' thing. It's about staving off the Beast just a little longer. It's also a good hunter thing, as they fight off the urge to become worse than what they hunt.

                    For Werewolf (or Mage), it's a bit of a useless point sink, if there isn't an actual story to tell around it.

                    Not exactly sure why you brought that up?


                    As for what magical Paths they can learn, it's as open as anyone else. Possibly more so, as in effect, the Skin Dancers (which I probably should have mentioned in my last post) were formed by a rogue Kinfolk that was gobbling up whatever magic he could find, and the BSDs basically created their own secret society that utilized Paths they helped create from their own Rites. (Wyld West)

                    Of course, the cost would have to be weighed. As I said, Resonance is going to be big deal at family gatherings. If the kin is focused on Cursing and Hellfire, might start to smell a bit on the Tainted side if he's not careful.
                    Path of Curses, in Hunters, Hunted II References, in 2 or 3 places, how it damages, your Humanity.

                    Does it become too overpowered, for a Kinfolk, since they dont have to worry about such things?

                    or change it, to a loss of Renown?

                    Since its a spiteful and often sadistic act?


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                    • #40
                      This thread is ancient as all hell, but I've kept working on my Sorcery rolls when I got bored. I'm like half done with them I reckon. Basically a mix of MtAw, Ars Magicka, and Dresden Files for everything in it. The idea is to make playable Hermetic Sorcerers, and that the Hermetic Theory is used as the basis for casting.
                      Currently have two things for casting: Ways and Path
                      Ways are your stylistic way of saying "I'm doing this sort of effect" and there's 4 of them: Creation, Destruction, Manipulation, and Transformation
                      As for Paths there's currently 13; 10 of them are in the Hermetic Theory, 3 of them are considered defunct or lost Paths of magic. There's a lot of similarity between the Spheres and Paths, but there's a big difference in that Paths are essentially self contained. Namely, this means your knowledge of making wards against teleporting doesn't help in wards against fire; each and every Path contains the ability to control an effect, not a Pattern like True Magick does. Many of the Paths have been altered in what they can do also, like Mind is about creating minds akin to Golems, but has difficulty doing mental effects. There's also limits on what each path of sorcery can and can't do.
                      Paths are
                      1. Vires (Forces)
                      2. Primus (Prime)
                      3. Materia (Matter)
                      4. Spiritus (Spirit)
                      5. Mortis (Death)
                      6. Fores (Portals)
                      7. Sortis (Fate)
                      8. Imaginem (Illusions)
                      9. Animus (Mind)
                      10. Vitae (Life)

                      Dead or lost paths are
                      1. Tempus (Time)
                      2. Abyssus (Abyss)
                      3. Nomen (Names)

                      There's also three types of spells: Evocations, Rituals, and Formula
                      Evocations are basically spells made on the fly using your knowledge of Sorcery to make them. They're not peak efficient but they get the job done.
                      Rituals are Evocations done over long term for more power. You can roll multiple times to get a bigger effect with these, unlike Evocations.
                      Formula are akin to Thaumaturgical Rituals, they do one thing and one thing only. You can't modify them on the fly as that would be doing an Evocation, but you could spend time and effort to make a new Formula.
                      If you guys care, I can post what I have. I should mention that this is for playing professional Sorcerers and not Hedge Magicians. For those that know Dresden Files, it's the difference between a Wizard of the White Council and a sorcerer.
                      Last edited by theoutlander523; 04-13-2017, 11:45 PM.


                      Check out my Sorcerer 20th homebrew and my update to Highlander: the Gathering for 20th Anniversary edition.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Prince of the Night View Post
                        Path of Curses, in Hunters, Hunted II References, in 2 or 3 places, how it damages, your Humanity.

                        Does it become too overpowered, for a Kinfolk, since they dont have to worry about such things?

                        or change it, to a loss of Renown?

                        Since its a spiteful and often sadistic act?
                        Well, as I said, if a Kinfolk isn't careful, use of heavily destructive Paths (especially spiritually destructive) could lead to Wyrm taint, and that won't go over well at family gatherings.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by theoutlander523 View Post
                          This thread is ancient as all hell, but I've kept working on my Sorcery rolls when I got bored. I'm like half done with them I reckon. Basically a mix of MtAw, Ars Magicka, and Dresden Files for everything in it. The idea is to make playable Hermetic Sorcerers, and that the Hermetic Theory is used as the basis for casting.
                          Currently have two things for casting: Ways and Path
                          Ways are your stylistic way of saying "I'm doing this sort of effect" and there's 4 of them: Creation, Destruction, Manipulation, and Transformation
                          As for Paths there's currently 13; 10 of them are in the Hermetic Theory, 3 of them are considered defunct or lost Paths of magic. There's a lot of similarity between the Spheres and Paths, but there's a big difference in that Paths are essentially self contained. Namely, this means your knowledge of making wards against teleporting doesn't help in wards against fire; each and every Path contains the ability to control an effect, not a Pattern like True Magick does. Many of the Paths have been altered in what they can do also, like Mind is about creating minds akin to Golems, but has difficulty doing mental effects. There's also limits on what each path of sorcery can and can't do.
                          Paths are
                          1. Vires (Forces)
                          2. Primus (Prime)
                          3. Materia (Matter)
                          4. Spiritus (Spirit)
                          5. Mortis (Death)
                          6. Fores (Portals)
                          7. Sortis (Fate)
                          8. Imaginem (Illusions)
                          9. Animus (Mind)
                          10. Vitae (Life)

                          Dead or lost paths are
                          1. Tempus (Time)
                          2. Abyssus (Abyss)
                          3. Nomen (Names)

                          There's also three types of spells: Evocations, Rituals, and Formula
                          Evocations are basically spells made on the fly using your knowledge of Sorcery to make them. They're not peak efficient but they get the job done.
                          Rituals are Evocations done over long term for more power. You can roll multiple times to get a bigger effect with these, unlike Evocations.
                          Formula are akin to Thaumaturgical Rituals, they do one thing and one thing only. You can't modify them on the fly as that would be doing an Evocation, but you could spend time and effort to make a new Formula.
                          If you guys care, I can post what I have. I should mention that this is for playing professional Sorcerers and not Hedge Magicians. For those that know Dresden Files, it's the difference between a Wizard of the White Council and a sorcerer.
                          Post away. This looks cool.


                          Writer, publisher, performer
                          Mostly he/his, sometimes she/her IRL https://adam-lowe.com

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by adambeyoncelowe View Post

                            Post away. This looks cool.
                            As I said, I've only worked on it partly and haven't finished up all the Paths yet. Haven't really needed to make the rules complete.




                            Check out my Sorcerer 20th homebrew and my update to Highlander: the Gathering for 20th Anniversary edition.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by theoutlander523 View Post

                              As I said, I've only worked on it partly and haven't finished up all the Paths yet. Haven't really needed to make the rules complete.

                              ​Been a while since I played it, but is this based on Sorcerer's Crusade? (Mage historical setting)

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by EvilTyger View Post

                                ​Been a while since I played it, but is this based on Sorcerer's Crusade? (Mage historical setting)
                                Might have subconsciously put some stuff in there, but I mostly used Mage the Awakening, Ars Magica, and the Sorcerer Revised as inspiration. Tried to go with the whole idea that Sorcery doesn't give you techniques, it gives results. So each path requires you know the ward requisite rating for using it in the Path and doesn't transfer between Paths. Also put in holes and unequal balance in the Paths to represent the problems with Hermetic theory.


                                Check out my Sorcerer 20th homebrew and my update to Highlander: the Gathering for 20th Anniversary edition.

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