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I took a look at Predator Types from V5, pp 175-178, to figure out if any are more valuable than others.
A word about methodology. What I am measuring is the cost of purchasing all the positive traits gained with the Predator Type, less the cost of buying off any flaws gained, when building a book-standard, non-thinblood pc. In other words, if your ST does not use PT, how much would it cost to build a character with these traits in-play after chagen?
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Valuing the discipline dot gained can be difficult, as it is dependent on the rest of the character build. There are several ways you can use the discipline dot gained:
Option 3 looks like the numerically most efficient use, but remember it can be difficult to learn an ooc discipline in-play, especially uncommon disciplines like Protean or Dominate. I am, however, looking at raw numbers, not in-game fluff, so, umm, never mind.
In any case, the value I use when tabulating is always option 2, as it splits the difference, as it were. I'm am confident the reader can add or subtract a few points, as required.
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A similar math issue arises with skill specialty, which is the equivalent of an additional dot usable for rolls in narrow circumstances. So, PT is one way a BSPC can begin with five "dice" in a skill's contribution to a dicepool. That is, if the player chooses to place four dots in a skill boosted by a specialty gained from a PT.
However, for simplicity's sake, I count the specialty as 3xp, the cost of purchasing a specialty.
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I count flaws by the cost to remove, but V5 is vague on how this works, and it is highly ST ruling dependent. I assume an ST would charge the player the cost of purchasing an equivalent merit, and require an in-game justification. So, a three dot flaw would cost 9 xp and a plot event to remove. Note, the plot requirement can range from simple to justify (Eat your enemy!) to the seemingly impossible. (How do you remove Stakebait?) So, ymmv.
Likewise, I count the cost of acquiring advantages later, in-play, using xp.
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The most difficult valuation is for lost or gained Humanity. Purchasing a dot of Humanity costs New Levelx10. It is the most expensive thing to increase in the game, and has ratings higher than other stats, making its increase even more expensive. It is usually around 7 in BSPCs, while the average attribute is only 2.4. These factors throw the curve, as it were, and makes any PT with a Humanity adjustment an outlier.
For many players, having a Humanity 1 higher or lower is not too big a deal, and they will just accept the higher or lower Humanity as part of the character concept. So, when tabulating values, I list the value with and without Humanity's value, assuming a BSPC Humanity of 7.
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Similarly, I have assumed a Blood Potency of 1, being raised to 2, costing 20xp. Keep in mind that higher blood potency is not an unmitigated positive in V5.
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Alleycat
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 22xp. Replacing the negative items costs 70 xp.
Net Value: You lose a net of 48xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 22xp.
Bagger
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 22xp. Cost to remove flaw is 6xp.
Note that Blood Sorcery is only available to Tremere with this PT, reducing the choice of disciplines to either Obfuscate or Obfuscate for other clans.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xpby taking this PT.
Blood Leech
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 33xp. Cost to remove flaws is 76xp.
Net Value: You lose a net of 43xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 27xp.
Cleaver
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 19xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Consensualist
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 93xp. Cost to remove flaws is 6xp.
Note the gain in Humanity is a large part of the value here, but that single dot can be very easily lost in play.
Net Value: You gain a net of 87xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 7xp.
Farmer
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 93xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Note the gain in Humanity is a large part of the value here, but that single dot can be very easily lost in play. Also, ask your ST how this PT works at higher blood potencies.
Net Value: You gain a net of 90xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 10xp.
Osiris
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 22xp. Cost to remove flaws is 6xp.
Note that Blood Sorcery is only available to Tremere. Also, the specialty in Performance is already free as part of the skill.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Sandman
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 16xp. Cost to remove flaws is 0xp.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Scene Queen
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 19xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Note you choose among three skills here for your specialty. This makes this PT slightly more custom.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Siren
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 19xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
A word about methodology. What I am measuring is the cost of purchasing all the positive traits gained with the Predator Type, less the cost of buying off any flaws gained, when building a book-standard, non-thinblood pc. In other words, if your ST does not use PT, how much would it cost to build a character with these traits in-play after chagen?
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Valuing the discipline dot gained can be difficult, as it is dependent on the rest of the character build. There are several ways you can use the discipline dot gained:
- PT is how "book standard pcs" begin with a dot in an out-of-clan discipline. In this instance, it would have a value of 7xp, the cost of purchasing the first dot ooc in-play.
- PT is how a BSPC begins with a second dot in two in-clan disciplines, by combining it with the one dot discipline chosen from their clan. In this instance, the dot would have a value of 10xp, the cost of purchasing the second dot in-play.
- PT is how a BSPC begins with a third dot in an in-clan discipline, by combining it with the two dot discipline chosen from their clan. In this instance, the dot would have a value of 15xp, the cost of purchasing the third dot in-play.
- If your ST chooses to allow a Thin-Blood BSPC to take a PT, it seems like they would gain the first dot in an ooc discipline, and presumably can grow from there. This is not explained anywhere in the book I can find, and is highly dependent on your ST's ruling. If this is allowed, it would be worth the same as option 1, plus whatever value a thinblood getting a stable discipline is worth.
Option 3 looks like the numerically most efficient use, but remember it can be difficult to learn an ooc discipline in-play, especially uncommon disciplines like Protean or Dominate. I am, however, looking at raw numbers, not in-game fluff, so, umm, never mind.
In any case, the value I use when tabulating is always option 2, as it splits the difference, as it were. I'm am confident the reader can add or subtract a few points, as required.
************************************************** ********************
A similar math issue arises with skill specialty, which is the equivalent of an additional dot usable for rolls in narrow circumstances. So, PT is one way a BSPC can begin with five "dice" in a skill's contribution to a dicepool. That is, if the player chooses to place four dots in a skill boosted by a specialty gained from a PT.
However, for simplicity's sake, I count the specialty as 3xp, the cost of purchasing a specialty.
************************************************** ********************
I count flaws by the cost to remove, but V5 is vague on how this works, and it is highly ST ruling dependent. I assume an ST would charge the player the cost of purchasing an equivalent merit, and require an in-game justification. So, a three dot flaw would cost 9 xp and a plot event to remove. Note, the plot requirement can range from simple to justify (Eat your enemy!) to the seemingly impossible. (How do you remove Stakebait?) So, ymmv.
Likewise, I count the cost of acquiring advantages later, in-play, using xp.
************************************************** ********************
The most difficult valuation is for lost or gained Humanity. Purchasing a dot of Humanity costs New Levelx10. It is the most expensive thing to increase in the game, and has ratings higher than other stats, making its increase even more expensive. It is usually around 7 in BSPCs, while the average attribute is only 2.4. These factors throw the curve, as it were, and makes any PT with a Humanity adjustment an outlier.
For many players, having a Humanity 1 higher or lower is not too big a deal, and they will just accept the higher or lower Humanity as part of the character concept. So, when tabulating values, I list the value with and without Humanity's value, assuming a BSPC Humanity of 7.
************************************************** ********************
Similarly, I have assumed a Blood Potency of 1, being raised to 2, costing 20xp. Keep in mind that higher blood potency is not an unmitigated positive in V5.
************************************************** ********************
Alleycat
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain three dots in Contacts. (cost 9xp)
- Lose a dot in Humanity. (Assuming a base Humanity of 7, which drops to 6, it would cost 70 xp to regain. See how Humanity makes this an outlier?)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 22xp. Replacing the negative items costs 70 xp.
Net Value: You lose a net of 48xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 22xp.
Bagger
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain Iron Gullet. (cost 9xp)
- Gain Enemy flaw. (cost to remove 6xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 22xp. Cost to remove flaw is 6xp.
Note that Blood Sorcery is only available to Tremere with this PT, reducing the choice of disciplines to either Obfuscate or Obfuscate for other clans.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xpby taking this PT.
Blood Leech
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Increase Blood Potency by 1. (cost 20xp)
- Lose a dot in Humanity. (Assuming a base Humanity of 7, which drops to 6, it would cost 70 xp to regain.)
- Gain a two point flaw. (cost to remove 6xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 33xp. Cost to remove flaws is 76xp.
Net Value: You lose a net of 43xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 27xp.
Cleaver
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain a one point flaw. (cost to remove 3xp)
- Gain a two point advantage. (cost 6xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 19xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Consensualist
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain one dot of Humanity. (cost 80xp)
- Gain a one point flaw. (cost to remove 3xp)
- Gain a one point flaw. (cost to remove 3xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 93xp. Cost to remove flaws is 6xp.
Note the gain in Humanity is a large part of the value here, but that single dot can be very easily lost in play.
Net Value: You gain a net of 87xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 7xp.
Farmer
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain one dot of Humanity. (cost 80xp)
- Gain a one point flaw. (cost to remove 3xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 93xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Note the gain in Humanity is a large part of the value here, but that single dot can be very easily lost in play. Also, ask your ST how this PT works at higher blood potencies.
Net Value: You gain a net of 90xp by taking this PT, if you care about Humanity. If not, this is equivalent to a gain of 10xp.
Osiris
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain three dots between Fame and Herd. (cost 9xp)
- Gain two dots in flaws. (cost to remove 6xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 22xp. Cost to remove flaws is 6xp.
Note that Blood Sorcery is only available to Tremere. Also, the specialty in Performance is already free as part of the skill.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Sandman
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain a one point advantage. (cost 3xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 16xp. Cost to remove flaws is 0xp.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Scene Queen
- Gain a specialty in one of three skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain a one point flaw. (cost to remove 3xp)
- Gain a one point advantage. (cost 3xp)
- Gain another one point advantage. (cost 3xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 19xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Note you choose among three skills here for your specialty. This makes this PT slightly more custom.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
Siren
- Gain a specialty in one of two skills. (cost 3xp)
- Gain a dot in one of two disciplines. (cost 10xp)
- Gain a one point flaw. (cost to remove 3xp)
- Gain a two point advantage. (cost 6xp)
Purchasing the positive items outside this Predator Type would cost 19xp. Cost to remove flaws is 3xp.
Net Value: You gain a net of 16xp by taking this PT.
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