No one expects the Second Inquisition!

[CTPhipps]

I mean, the copyright stamp is outright disfiguring this book.

[monteparnas]

Feh. There are fan hacks of V5 Sabbat and White Wolf made them a playable sect as far back as 2nd edition. In V5 they are diminished from what they were, but the Sabbat are not unplayable antagonists. For the moment at least, the SI are unplayable antagonists.

Hacking them into playable will be a piece of cake. Despite the past, they indeed doubled down the canonical Sabbat into this role.

Also, there's no Imbued, the SI are going to be antagonists for other hunters, and comparing them to the Sabbat in terms of how they treat humanity kind of shows how low they are.

On the pdf structure... I guess if they don't redo things, this will be the book even people that bought it will also download the illegal copy to have an actually good pdf...

[Grumpy RPG Reviews]

Feh. There are fan hacks of V5 Sabbat and White Wolf made them a playable sect as far back as 2nd edition. In V5 they are diminished from what they were, but the Sabbat are not unplayable antagonists. For the moment at least, the SI are unplayable antagonists.

[CTPhipps]

I read somewhere the SI doesn't like the imbued, and those hunters do not often work with the S.I. Which is interesting.

That said, the S.I. is not worse to people than the Sabbat. And to a large degree the S.I. has taken the narrative position the Sabbat once occupied; unplayable antagonists who harass and hunt Camarilla society, and the best protection from them is to lick the prince's boots. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I mean, I wish this had been the case but the Sabbat STILL occupy this role.

*sad trombone*

[Amethyst]

Imma wait till it comes out on DTRPG and maybe buy it then.

[Grumpy RPG Reviews]

So, no, it's a group other hunters tend to think of as scummy.

I read somewhere the SI doesn't like the imbued, and those hunters do not often work with the S.I. Which is interesting.

That said, the S.I. is not worse to people than the Sabbat. And to a large degree the S.I. has taken the narrative position the Sabbat once occupied; unplayable antagonists who harass and hunt Camarilla society, and the best protection from them is to lick the prince's boots. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[Gangrel44]

This is very much a book that doesn't attempt to argue the ends justify the means.

It absolutely establishes the Second Inquisition are scum who murder, torture, kidnap, and any good they do is incidental to the abuses they heap on mortals as well as vampires who don't want to be what they are. Every page drips in disdain and disgust.

They're not cartoons but if I had to say, "Isn't the Technocracy right for wanting to wipe the supernatural out?" questionm this book goes, "Their goals don't matter because WHAT THEY'RE DOING is unconscionable."

So, no, it's a group other hunters tend to think of as scummy.

And let's not forget good old-fashioned abject hypocrisy...

[CTPhipps]

I hope they don't they don't downplay the brutal truth the 2nd inquisitions attempt to annihilate the vampire race is a net positive. Moral ambiguities are neat but the the night mean right wing Catholic Church isn't an ongoing existential threat on a personal and species scale.

This is very much a book that doesn't attempt to argue the ends justify the means.

It absolutely establishes the Second Inquisition are scum who murder, torture, kidnap, and any good they do is incidental to the abuses they heap on mortals as well as vampires who don't want to be what they are. Every page drips in disdain and disgust.

They're not cartoons but if I had to say, "Isn't the Technocracy right for wanting to wipe the supernatural out?" questionm this book goes, "Their goals don't matter because WHAT THEY'RE DOING is unconscionable."

So, no, it's a group other hunters tend to think of as scummy.

[Ragged Robin]

I hope they don't they don't downplay the brutal truth the 2nd inquisitions attempt to annihilate the vampire race is a net positive. Moral ambiguities are neat but the mean right wing Catholic Church isn't an ongoing existential threat on a personal and species scale.

[Grumpy RPG Reviews]

Frankly, I think this warrants a letter to the good people at Renegade that they should remove this and give us unmarked copies or give us a refund.

I don't need to be reminded Piracy is WrongTM on EVERY page.

I agree and will sign any petition for this cause.

[CTPhipps]

I... am really not happy with this sizable copyright thing on the bottom of a pdf I dropped 40+ dollars on after money conversion. It routinely cuts through the art, it cuts through the cover, it's huge, it's on every page (there are any number of watermarked pdfs done better than this all across gaming). I am not even fully diving into the actual content yet and that this pdf is.. not even bookmarked, has this distorting watermark thing, is definitely really short for its price point, and looks to involve a lot of white space as far as the pages that do have text, it's not great. The formatting makes it feel like there's not much content per page, on top of everything else.

It's going to take me a while to actually have an opinion on the actual content. I am really not happy with how Renegade seems to have decided to approach publishing and pricing their V5 pdfs, certainly if this is any example.

I've been following along with V5 in some hope that there will be a book that eventually brings me over into it (the OPP stuff wasn't bad, for what it's worth), but I think I'm done after the player's guide at this point if this is how the structuring is going to go.

Frankly, I think this warrants a letter to the good people at Renegade that they should remove this and give us unmarked copies or give us a refund.

I don't need to be reminded Piracy is WrongTM on EVERY page.

[MarkK]

I... am really not happy with this sizable copyright thing on the bottom of a pdf I dropped 40+ dollars on after money conversion. It routinely cuts through the art, it cuts through the cover, it's huge, it's on every page (there are any number of watermarked pdfs done better than this all across gaming). I am not even fully diving into the actual content yet and that this pdf is.. not even bookmarked, has this distorting watermark thing, is definitely really short for its price point, and looks to involve a lot of white space as far as the pages that do have text, it's not great. The formatting makes it feel like there's not much content per page, on top of everything else.

It's going to take me a while to actually have an opinion on the actual content. I am really not happy with how Renegade seems to have decided to approach publishing and pricing their V5 pdfs, certainly if this is any example.

I've been following along with V5 in some hope that there will be a book that eventually brings me over into it (the OPP stuff wasn't bad, for what it's worth), but I think I'm done after the player's guide at this point if this is how the structuring is going to go.

[Grumpy RPG Reviews]

ITS AT THE BOTTOM OF EVERY PAGE.

Yeah, I don't like it either.

And I think you're selling COG short. Using mirrors to travel to other worlds sounds bad ass, as do face stealing vampires (some Tzimisce are taking notes).

[SetiteFriend]

Does that actually give the pdf currently or just pre orders it for when it later otherwise releases (presumably in April)?

I imagine so, giving it later wouldn't make sense. Their policy is to release the PDF some weeks earlier anyway, the website probably just hasn't been updated

[CTPhipps]

Does that actually give the pdf currently or just pre orders it for when it later otherwise releases (presumably in April)?

Renegade Studios is kind of, well I'm not going to be insulting, but I'm giving it some sideeye regarding copyright.

This is at the bottom of my downloaded copy that I paid for.


ITS AT THE BOTTOM OF EVERY PAGE.

On the other hand I have to agree that for a RL statement joining Russia to them will be tricky, unless they confirm that the SI is more linked to conservative power structures within governments than to the governments themselves.

The Second Inquisition is a very loose alliance (and even that is stretching the definition) of organizations working together and sharing information. There is no heirarchy of nations or central organization among them. Which is actually stated to be a reason why the Camarilla couldn't contain or defeat the SI.

PROJECT: FIRSTLIGHT for example doesn't actually run the SAD or other vampire hunting branches of the US government. They just accumulate information from the legitimate branches of the US intelligence structure and then pass them down to the others. They also try and arrange attacks on vampires form people who don't KNOW vampires exist like freezing assets, blowing up buildings, or arresting minions so it becomes even more impossible to trace and more likely for vampires to assume other vampires are doing it.

The book also clarifies there's a kind of weird humor element like Buffy's musical episode.

HOW THE SECOND INQUISITION BECAME INTERNATIONAL

*CIA agent awkwardly walks into FSB office*

*looks around*

CIA Agent: Uh, guys, did anyone...last night...uh....run into vampires?

FSB: OH, YEAH! I DID!

CIA Agent: Oh thank God. When did you discover vampires existed?

FSB: 30 years ago?

CIA Agent: ...awkward.

FSB: Yeah, there was this ancient hag named Baba Yaga that killed like tens of thousands of people.

CIA Agent: Okay, that's just bullshit.

FSB: THATS WHY WE DIDNT TELL ANYONE!

(That's not in the book but it is the vibe I'm getting)