Shapeshifters of Europe?

[Just Some Guy]

Got an upcoming campaign set in Europe, particularly in Ireland and Germany, but I'm not sure which of the Changing Breeds are native to the area. I know the Gets and Fianna are, obviously, but the Fera in general elude me; I think I remember reading that the Bears, Rats, and Ravens were originally from Europe, but I'm not sure. Can anyone confirm which Fera are natives to Ireland and Germany?

[Heavy Arms]

How native do you want things to get? Silent Striders aren't "native" to Europe, but they've also been in Europe for thousands of years.

Do you want to include extinct groups? Which can also be long term extinct or more recently so?

[Just Some Guy]

I was admittedly wanting to aim for races that were only native, so no Silent Striders I suppose.

Extinct races are fine, though.

[Heavy Arms]

OK:

Ananasi
Apis - long extinct
Bastet - The Ceilican were the native Bastet of Europe, but are functionally extinct recently. Up to the ST if any are still around, but they're in hiding since the BSDs are on the look out for any that escaped.
Corax
Grondr - long extinct
Mokole - Maybe, possibly, the Ao, but nobody knows for sure (despite their super-memory), long extinct
Ratkin
Rokea - No known presence on the land, but there are sharks native to the areas in question, so there are going to be Rokea in the water somewhere.

[Psicose]

The Shadow Lords and The Black Furies are from there too, aren't they?

[Damian May]

In terms of Garou tribes that got their start( or at least part of the Tribe arose there) in Europe:-

Fenrir, Fianna, Black Furies, Shadowlords, Silver Fangs, Glasswalkers, Red Talons.

Garou that did not arise there but have been there at least 10K years:-

Children of Gaia, Bone Gnawers, Silent Striders.

Garou that were essentially absent from Europe until recently:-

Stargazers, Older Brother, Younger Brother.

Fera:-

Ajaba- present in Palaeolithic but rare to missing afterward.
Ceilican:- present up till very recently or hiding but present.
Qualmi:- rare but present
Ananasi:- present
Gurahl:- present
Corax- present
Rokea- present
Mokole- essentially non-existant except in super rare instances.
Nagah- present but rare.
Ratkin- present
Nuwisha- essentially non-existant except in super rare instances.
Kitsune- absent
Kumo- absent
Simba/Swara- present in Palaeolithic

Grondr/Apis- present in Palaeolithic.

[No One of Consequence]

Ireland and Germany are primarily the core territory of the Fianna and Get of Fenris, respectively.
The urban areas of both areas are also home to the Glasswalkers, and to a lesser extent, the Bone Gnawers.
In addition, the Silver Fang's House Austere Howl has been centered in the British Isles (mainly England) but recently have sought sanctuary with the Fianna of Ireland. This is mainly the result of their conflicts with House Gleaming Eye, who are primarily centered in Germany, as well as northern France and southern Scandinavia. (There's also House Crescent Moon in Russia.)
The Children of Gaia have the habit of going anywhere they feel like, especially places they feel are in need of their enlightened wisdom and guidance (such as post WW2 and post reunification Germany and 20th century Ireland).
There are Red Talons in Europe, but given the relatively low wolf population (compared to places like North America and Asia), they probably have to struggled for their place.
The Black Furies and Shadow Lords have always tended to focus around the Eastern Mediterranean, Balkins, and Black Sea areas, as well as parts of Italy, and in the case of the Shadow Lords Poland, but also have their place in Iberia and other spots. The Furies' focus on women's issues has caused them to migrate all over the place.
The largest group of European Silent Striders has traditionally been those associated with the Roma. However, the relatively recent influx of Middle Eastern and South Asian immigrants to Europe has probably brought more of them.

Both Ireland and Germany have their own subcultures of the Corax, tied to the legends of the Morrigan and to Odin's ravens, respectively. (I like to believe that there's a third group in Greece that draws inspiration from Apollo

Gurahl aren't very common in Europe, owing mostly to the War(s) of Rage. However, they are mystically tied to the various legends of sleeping kings, including those from Britain and Germany. Those that are active in Europe probably do everything they can to go unnoticed, outside of the very rare Red Talon or possibly Child of Gaia ally.

The Ceilican are/were native to Western Europe. This tended to focus on Ireland and other Celtic areas. (I personally like to tie them equally to Germanic traditions, especially the use of cats as symbols for seidr witchcraft and the goddess Freya, among other things.)

The Ratkin are common everywhere, including Europe. Their breed book included the idea of "plagues" which tended to dominate the Ratkin culture of each continent. The European one was the Gamine, who IIRC were centered in France and meant to be mainly European style thieves. (I may be misremembering. I honestly find the plagues more than a little weak both in conception and execution.)

There are sharks in the waters off Ireland, but Rokea rarely come on land, so if any show up, it's up to you.

The Ananasi are as common in Europe as they are anywhere in the temperate climates of the world.

[Shadeprowler]

In terms of Garou tribes that got their start( or at least part of the Tribe arose there) in Europe:-

Fenrir, Fianna, Black Furies, Shadowlords, Silver Fangs, Glasswalkers, Red Talons.

Garou that did not arise there but have been there at least 10K years:-

Children of Gaia, Bone Gnawers, Silent Striders.

Garou that were essentially absent from Europe until recently:-

Stargazers, Older Brother, Younger Brother.

Fera:-

Ajaba- present in Palaeolithic but rare to missing afterward.
Ceilican:- present up till very recently or hiding but present.
Qualmi:- rare but present
Ananasi:- present
Gurahl:- present
Corax- present
Rokea- present
Mokole- essentially non-existant except in super rare instances.
Nagah- present but rare.
Ratkin- present
Nuwisha- essentially non-existant except in super rare instances.
Kitsune- absent
Kumo- absent
Simba/Swara- present in Palaeolithic

Grondr/Apis- present in Palaeolithic.

I alwas toyed the idea, in the story of Saint George and the Dragon it was a Mokolé, not a Tzimisce
But Europe had a very nice Bat population too if I remember correctly, went extinct sure... (Thanks to the old misunderstanding of the Tzimsice Chirpateran marauder forrm and the Shadow Lord's bad experience)
...or hybernated like the Gurahl (bats)
The Xibalan cropped up in every Camazotz community around the globe... maybe they contributed to the bats bad reputation

[Heavy Arms]

Generally, the books have presented the Corax being the "eyes" of the northern hemisphere, and the Camazotz as being their counterparts to the south. Ravens and bats are not nearly so neatly divided (but foxes aren't restricted to Japan and immediate main-land Asia either, and snakes aren't restricted to India), but for some reason the Fera are presented as respecting that in broad strokes.

It's one of those things where basic real world facts took a pretty massive back seat towards thematic concepts in the setting that haven't held up well over time.

[Ana Mizuki]

Generally, the books have presented the Corax being the "eyes" of the northern hemisphere, and the Camazotz as being their counterparts to the south. Ravens and bats are not nearly so neatly divided (but foxes aren't restricted to Japan and immediate main-land Asia either, and snakes aren't restricted to India), but for some reason the Fera are presented as respecting that in broad strokes.

It's one of those things where basic real world facts took a pretty massive back seat towards thematic concepts in the setting that haven't held up well over time.

This is why I generally just ignore the divides. Especially as some fera are very specific (kitsune, nuwisha) while others include ALL the snakes and ALL the spiders. So I generally go by animal location and make up house rules for Qualmi not from NA and Kitsune not from East-Asia.

[Asmodai]

I have a group of European Kitsune that moved in from the east around 600 AD, and have turned into a chivalric order of adventurers based in France. I still keep them rare, though.

[No One of Consequence]

I will mention the legend of St. George and the dragon takes place in Cappadocia (eastern Anatolia/Turkey) back when it was the frontier of the Roman empire. The earliest iconography apparently tends to involve a giant serpent, and between that, the creature's toxic venom-spewing nature, and that it is often interpreted to be a physical embodiment of sin, it is the sort of thing that feels more like a Wyrm monster rather than a Mokole, at least IMO.

[Asmodai]

Generally, the books have presented the Corax being the "eyes" of the northern hemisphere, and the Camazotz as being their counterparts to the south. Ravens and bats are not nearly so neatly divided (but foxes aren't restricted to Japan and immediate main-land Asia either, and snakes aren't restricted to India), but for some reason the Fera are presented as respecting that in broad strokes.

It's one of those things where basic real world facts took a pretty massive back seat towards thematic concepts in the setting that haven't held up well over time.

I've always thought that originally the Camatotz were the Eyes of Night, while the Corax were the Eyes of Day. They both operated all over the world, but the Camatotz tended to be much more secretive than the Corax and that resulted in them having few allies and many paranoid Garou on their cases during the War of Rage. The ones in South America were just the last foothold of the breed that got wiped out later in history. Corax are the Eyes and blabbermouths of the Fera because they filled in the niche the Camatotz were supposed to take.

I will mention the legend of St. George and the dragon takes place in Cappadocia (eastern Anatolia/Turkey) back when it was the frontier of the Roman empire. The earliest iconography apparently tends to involve a giant serpent, and between that, the creature's toxic venom-spewing nature, and that it is often interpreted to be a physical embodiment of sin, it is the sort of thing that feels more like a Wyrm monster rather than a Mokole, at least IMO.

I'd generally agree with that. Dragons in traditional European myth tend to be closely tied to sin, wickedness and assorted devilry and the Mokole don't really resonate with that. They also get up to things that you usually wouldn't really see the Mokole doing, they usually just want to be left alone. However, I could totally see for instance the whole event including either some form of a corrupted Mokole, or even a horribly misrepresented series of events in which a Mokole was seeking to save his kinfolk from being ghouled by a Vampire Lord?

[Prometheas]

This is why I generally just ignore the divides. Especially as some fera are very specific (kitsune, nuwisha) while others include ALL the snakes and ALL the spiders. So I generally go by animal location and make up house rules for Qualmi not from NA and Kitsune not from East-Asia.

I still have massive gripes about the fact that whitewolf went full anime with their interpreation of fox shifters, despite the fact that the mythology of the native populous of north america has a massive collection fox-shifter lore.

Ditto for the australian nuwasha, despite the WTA interpretation of Coyote having much more in common with north american mythology.

[Alqamar Alaswad]

This is why I generally just ignore the divides. Especially as some fera are very specific (kitsune, nuwisha) while others include ALL the snakes and ALL the spiders. So I generally go by animal location and make up house rules for Qualmi not from NA and Kitsune not from East-Asia.

If I may, I suggest you take a look at the books released for Werewolf: Savage Age (a pre-10000 BCE written by a highly talented group of White Wolf / Onyx Path authors and some bumbling monkeys, including yours truly. They (we) are currently working on massive books on reptile-shifters and arthropod-shifters, adressing the questions "Why are all the snakes..." and "All the spiders...?".

I specially recommend the Corax/Rapax and Uktana (Camazotz) Breedbooks, and the Advanced Player's Guide, which adds tons of info to the Apis, Bastet, Garou, Grondr and Gurahl.

I don't remember if it's ok to post link to outside sites (DrivethruRPG) here, so PM me if you would like more info...