Why Do You Think Beast is Good/Bad?

[Elfive]

Any open conflict with humans would drag in the other supernaturals, and they all know this.

[RickmanUK]

Really the only main reason Humans are "On Top" in CofD.... Is because of Numbers and the fact the ones that are aware of the Supernatural Are complete Bastards when it comes to fighting. Desperation leads to monstrosity of it's own.... The reasons for the Masquerade and the like are simply because it's easier to avoid the direct conflict with the Humans then to fight them, the end result of any major conflict is to many Deaths. (Unless that is the goal.. then Rock on)

[Dusksage]

Ah, but then it would be supernatural creatures using human tools to kill humans!

Really, my point was more that human's lack of supernatural powers it what led to the development of science, technology, and medicine to make up the difference. Absence doesn't equate to weakness. Absence equates to necessary ingenuity. For example a dragon wouldn't logically need a bomb to destroy what's threatening it because it can just burnenate the countryside with it's fire breath that it's immune too. While a human would more logically use a bomb because it lacks said immunity and is desperate to either stay alive or protect it's home or progeny. That desperation is sort of itself a kind of superpower. Something that forces out all of the advantages and skills a human has when faced with seemingly insurmountable odds, something that a lot of supernatural creatures either don't need to worry about as much or grow distant from as their power rises (with a few exception from even more far removed monsters from humanity like the Strix, Idigam, and True Fae.)

[White Oak Dragon]

Alright, I love Beast and supernaturals just like everyone else here. But don't get too cocky.

I believe Ameraaaaaa's point was that there's a very good reason why Humans are feared by literally all other supernatural splats: They frustratingly adapt to their situations, and when determined are capable of accomplishing feats that would be normally improbable. I know earlier in the discussion their intelligence and technology was pretty much openly dismissed in favor of supernatural resilience and powers, and that's bogus because bombs count as technology and are a byproduct of human intelligence. And all supernatural splats will either die from explosions, or be fucked up in ways that they wish they would have died. Just like anything else caught in an explosion.

And that's just one example. Technology and human ingenuity make up the difference for lack of supernatural resilience and powers. And not having those benefits naturally makes humans fully aware of their frailty, which is why they're WILLING to go to such extremes when faced with the supernatural and reminded of just how fragile their lives are. That's why Hunters exist in the first place, and why the more collateral damage a monster make the shorter their lifespan becomes (with the sole exception of Mummies, but f$&k who would actually want to be one of the Arisen.) And in it's own way that's why Heroes exist, they're manifestations of Humanity's death anxiety given form within a normal human who gains preternatural abilities based around asserting dominance over the manifestation of human frailties, the Begotten themselves, or at least in a sense of things.

So in conclusion: Yes Mr. Dragon, it won't be the fire from the air to surface missile that kills you. It'll be the sheer concussive force from the missile that kills you. Along with killing everything else in the building, human or otherwise. That's why bombs are so terrifying.

The issue isn't whether human intelligence and technology can be used against supernatural creatures. They totally can be. The issue is that those things aren't possessed by humans alone. The supernatural creatures can use those things, too. It isn't "intelligence + technology vs magic powers". It's "intelligence + technology vs intelligence + technology + magic powers".

[Dusksage]

Alright, I love Beast and supernaturals just like everyone else here. But don't get too cocky.

I believe Ameraaaaaa's point was that there's a very good reason why Humans are feared by literally all other supernatural splats: They frustratingly adapt to their situations, and when determined are capable of accomplishing feats that would be normally improbable. I know earlier in the discussion their intelligence and technology was pretty much openly dismissed in favor of supernatural resilience and powers, and that's bogus because bombs count as technology and are a byproduct of human intelligence. And all supernatural splats will either die from explosions, or be fucked up in ways that they wish they would have died. Just like anything else caught in an explosion.

And that's just one example. Technology and human ingenuity make up the difference for lack of supernatural resilience and powers. And not having those benefits naturally makes humans fully aware of their frailty, which is why they're WILLING to go to such extremes when faced with the supernatural and reminded of just how fragile their lives are. That's why Hunters exist in the first place, and why the more collateral damage a monster make the shorter their lifespan becomes (with the sole exception of Mummies, but f$&k who would actually want to be one of the Arisen.) And in it's own way that's why Heroes exist, they're manifestations of Humanity's death anxiety given form within a normal human who gains preternatural abilities based around asserting dominance over the manifestation of human frailties, the Begotten themselves, or at least in a sense of things.

So in conclusion: Yes Mr. Dragon, it won't be the fire from the air to surface missile that kills you. It'll be the sheer concussive force from the missile that kills you. Along with killing everything else in the building, human or otherwise. That's why bombs are so terrifying.

[Paradim]

See? This is why Beast is fun

When I realized that potential scenario... That was the moment I fell in love with Beast: The Primordial.

[Elfive]

Other possible beast characters include "Literally Batman".

[Daigotsu Max]

"Fuck you, I'm a dragon!" -the response from a Beast to a very terrified and confused vampire after the building was suddenly set on fire.

See? This is why Beast is fun

[Vent0]

"Knowing their weakness, I threw wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their limit and shut down!"

Another CoD - relevant quote. This one pertaining to 'human superiority.'





Well, now you're being offensive to Otherkin.

Don't forget AIs.

[Paradim]

Well, now you're being offensive to Otherkin.

"Fuck you, I'm a dragon!" -the response from a Beast to a very terrified and confused vampire after the building was suddenly set on fire.

[Nyrufa]

"Turns out it's man!"

Another CofD-relevant Futurama quote...

"Knowing their weakness, I threw wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their limit and shut down!"

Another CoD - relevant quote. This one pertaining to 'human superiority.'

We're all human what can i say

Well, now you're being offensive to Otherkin.

[nalak42]

Monster have so much weekness that a smart human can beet any monster plus i just feel great to be human We're all human what can i say

LMAO, you are aware humans have way more weaknesses than most of the splats? They heal slowly, are vulnerable to a large number of enviormental complications, and have crap perception. A garou can take a shotgun blast with far more survivability than a human if silver rounds aren't involved, humans just don't get extra from silver.

The Beghotten actually have a nice one I'm fond of, to bring back topic, they don't really have a set weakness. I mean starvation is the big threat to most Beasts, but what starves one of the Beasts will vary in a case to case basis. After that their weaknesses are entirely imbued by their primary predator species. Plus there's a kind of amusement in the fact that even the subsections of a Beast are not necessarily identifiable as the same species. A leviathan is not identified as the same family as a nightmare pirahnna swarm even though both might be Makara.

[Yossarian]

Well said, Nyrufa. I agree with you. I'm reminded of a Futurama quote:

"The human was impervious to our most powerful magnetic fields, yet in the end he succumbed to a harmless sharpened stick!"

Yes, a smart human might be able to take down a more powerful monster, but I'd be inclined to think that a smart monster would have a better chance of doing so in most situations.

"Turns out it's man!"

Another CofD-relevant Futurama quote...

[White Oak Dragon]

I think you are drastically overestimating the power of humanity.

Monsters in CoD don't have anywhere near as many weaknesses as human do. In fact, a bunch of these monsters become immune to the weaknesses that plague the human condition. And even if there are some weaknesses that they retain upon their transformation, they can recover from these weaknesses in record time. A human would be knocked out of commission for months just by suffering a broken leg, but a Bampire, Werewolf, or some Beasts would be back on their feet within the next hour and come seeking revenge upon whatever human saw fit to pick a fight with them.

Well said, Nyrufa. I agree with you. I'm reminded of a Futurama quote:

"The human was impervious to our most powerful magnetic fields, yet in the end he succumbed to a harmless sharpened stick!"

Yes, a smart human might be able to take down a more powerful monster, but I'd be inclined to think that a smart monster would have a better chance of doing so in most situations.

[Nyrufa]

Monster have so much weekness that a smart human can beet any monster plus i just feel great to be human We're all human what can i say

I think you are drastically overestimating the power of humanity.

Monsters in CoD don't have anywhere near as many weaknesses as human do. In fact, a bunch of these monsters become immune to the weaknesses that plague the human condition. And even if there are some weaknesses that they retain upon their transformation, they can recover from these weaknesses in record time. A human would be knocked out of commission for months just by suffering a broken leg, but a Vampire, Werewolf, or some Beasts would be back on their feet within the next hour and come seeking revenge upon whatever human saw fit to pick a fight with them.

Most of the monsters exceed the human life span by multiple centuries, affording them more experience and knowledge than any human could acquire, and allowing them to remain in their prime long after their enemies have begun to break down from age and disease. And a sufficiently powerful monster can wield supernatural powers that rival the effects of WMD's, such as a Stormlord Werewolf who can manipulate the weather to summon a tornado, or an Incarnate Beast who's body is so toxic that it kills everything in a 50 yard radius.


You can keep your weak, pitiful humanity. I'll take the powerful monster route any day.