Changeling Kickstarter Discussion

[haren]

I've said it before... but there are inconsistencies with how Seeming and Kith is presented in this book.

It's annoying. Well, regardless when I run this, I'm going to rule it that a beast is not just a literal animal (but can be).

I might be wrong, but I think that is basically saying that if you're a Beast Hunterheart, you only exhibit those traits, and similarly, it's going to emphasize the hunter traits of any other Seeming.

[tasti man LH]

Eh, either way: at least now I can finally get started on building my Toontown freehold and courts...

[haren]

One thing that I doubt will get mentioned much, but I'm glad is in there are the discussion of different comfort/safety mechanisms you can use in a game. Definitely nice to see.

[xiongrey]

I might be wrong, but I think that is basically saying that if you're a Beast Hunterheart, you only exhibit those traits, and similarly, it's going to emphasize the hunter traits of any other Seeming.

I need to read a bit earlier I guess because in the "Build a Court" section has this mention:

... a vulpine Darkling Hunterheart or a ...

Which indicates that just because the Keeper made one into an animal doesn't make them a beast (or any other way). That's good cause I really didn't want it to go the way of 1st ed (all beasts were animals w/ kith as the specific animal. All fairest were elves w/ kith as the specific trope. All elementals were made of an element w/ kith as the specific element. all darklings were made from darkness and shadows w/ kith as the specific expression. ETC).

I did not want that.

[Second Chances]

One thing that I doubt will get mentioned much, but I'm glad is in there are the discussion of different comfort/safety mechanisms you can use in a game. Definitely nice to see.

Agreed. Its an important section to have.

[Second Chances]

Customization rules are pretty much exactly what I feared them to be. They break down the necessary considerations well enough but ultimately a Storyteller is going to have be eyeballing a bunch of mechanics and hoping they didn't inadvertently create something too weak/powerful. Nothing here is crunchy or well defined enough to bypass the usual obstacles to implementing custom material.

Please don't take this to mean that I actively dislike the product as a whole, but all prior complaints stand. Maybe we'll get something better if we hit the corresponding stretch goal for the companion book.

Can you unpack this a bit more? I found the Kith and Court guides to be very concrete. Contracts, admittedly I would like some explicit benchmarks, but I think they are still workable.

[Omegaphallic]

How would you say Fae Touched compare to other minor templates?

I'm give you a basic sense of it. A brand new Fae Touched whose Changeling escaped Arcadia.

She has two Common Contracts, Loyal Servant amd Glimpse of a Distant Mirror. She can Seal the promises of mortals. When fortifying her promise add 1 bonus die to the pool. Her and her Changeling can harvest glamour from each other, and can spend a glamour to find out the others location, emotions, and so on. She can make Oaths to Changelings. She can get court goodwill. Use Fae Touched Merits.

Loyal Servant, Glimpse of a Distant Mirror, and Sealings don't require a roll and there for can't fall unless someine else uses magic that causes a clash of wills.

Loyal Servants means this new character Fae Touched can summon Loyal Servants from fire, electricity, air, gravity, sound, water, earth, shadow, poop, light, plastic, diamonds, and countless other substances.

That's pretty powerful, but a ghoul can use three disciplines, use vitae to heal, and some other stuff. But has a much harder time refueling, dependent on vampires for fuel. Actually the Fae Touched can harvest glamour from Vampires so can she.

[haren]

How would you say Fae Touched compare to other minor templates?

I'm give you a basic sense of it. A brand new Fae Touched whose Changeling escaped Arcadia.

She has two Common Contracts, Loyal Servant amd Glimpse of a Distant Mirror. She can Seal the promises of mortals. When fortifying her promise add 1 bonus die to the pool. Her and her Changeling can harvest glamour from each other, and can spend a glamour to find out the others location, emotions, and so on. She can make Oaths to Changelings. She can get court goodwill. Use Fae Touched Merits.

Loyal Servant, Glimpse of a Distant Mirror, and Sealings don't require a roll and there for can't fall unless someine else uses magic that causes a clash of wills.

Loyal Servants means this new character Fae Touched can summon Loyal Servants from fire, electricity, air, gravity, sound, water, earth, shadow, poop, light, plastic, diamonds, and countless other substances.

That's pretty powerful, but a ghoul can use three disciplines, use vitae to heal, and some other stuff. But has a much harder time refueling, dependent on vampires for fuel. Actually the Fae Touched can harvest glamour from Vampires so can she.

One thing the text implies, namely the Fae Touched sees the Fetch of their linked changeling as what they REALLY ARE. I think the other thing to not discount is Fae Touched are lacking a lot of information about their state that say... a ghoul probably will know more.

[Taidragon]

It probably helps that Changeling societies tend to be a lot less cutthroat than Vampire societies are (if you pardon the pun). Ghouls tend to be on a pretty short leash and can't really do much against their masters - while Fae Touched aren't typically equals with Changelings, they're at least not yanked around nearly so much.

[HaplessWithDice]

Can you unpack this a bit more? I found the Kith and Court guides to be very concrete. Contracts, admittedly I would like some explicit benchmarks, but I think they are still workable.

I think I can help here because while I found the court and contract making sections much more useable, the kith making section was...lacking in key elements.

• Power Ceiling - How much bonus can a Kith trickery give, what's the upper limit of that power? This needs to be spelled out.
• Power Floor - What is the minimum mark. At the least a kith should be able to do X, if it does less than X it should be considered for a merit/contract/ect.

Those two pieces of information would make the Kith creation section worth while. Otherwise you end up with Kiths like my Efreet (used alternate spelling to not step on official Ifrit kith)

[Omegaphallic]

It probably helps that Changeling societies tend to be a lot less cutthroat than Vampire societies are (if you pardon the pun). Ghouls tend to be on a pretty short leash and can't really do much against their masters - while Fae Touched aren't typically equals with Changelings, they're at least not yanked around nearly so much.

Even bigger Fae Touched are usually not going to be subjected to the abuse that Ghoul gets as a matter of course.

[Firefly Night]

huh. so we aren't gonna have entitlements in the corebook, huh?

[Second Chances]

huh. so we aren't gonna have entitlements in the corebook, huh?

Not super surprising. Mage is the only 2e core to talk about their z-splat in any detail.

[LokiRavenSpeak]

Finally got around to check the new preview, still no rules to how to design tokens

And the guide to making Contracts is barebones and doesn't take into account Seeming variations. At least the mantle construction is better done.

[wyrdhamster]

I REALLY hope that Companion section on Courts will use those of corebook Freeholds as examples to show it's rules. Without those examples of using guidlines we do not have anything CONCRETE about those Courts in Rejkiavik, New Orleans, New England and Hong Kong.