Ask a simple question: Fallen World edition

[Kaimuund]

Thank you,

I have another I'm having some back and forth over --->

Legacy Attainments -- the part about successes.

I have a player that is wondering if they have Fate 4, do their Attainments count as exceptional successes, or Fate 5 for that matter based on the section talking about the number of successes the Attainment is assumed to have.

I feel like since there is no spell casting roll, there can't be an exceptional success. That would let players very easily break the game if they wanted to just spam their Attainment for Exceptional Success benefits, and also would allow them to remove withstand on some abilities that use Withstand as a major balancing mechanic.

Additionally, can you think of any instances when the successes would come into play? A Clash of Wills would still use the Mage's Gnosis + Arcana right, and not the successes of the Attainment?

Are there any instances then where this comes up?

[TempleBuilder]

Thank you,

I have another I'm having some back and forth over --->

Legacy Attainments -- the part about successes.

I have a player that is wondering if they have Fate 4, do their Attainments count as exceptional successes, or Fate 5 for that matter based on the section talking about the number of successes the Attainment is assumed to have.

I feel like since there is no spell casting roll, there can't be an exceptional success. That would let players very easily break the game if they wanted to just spam their Attainment for Exceptional Success benefits, and also would allow them to remove withstand on some abilities that use Withstand as a major balancing mechanic.

Your intuition is correct, it just activates without the benefits of however many successes.

Additionally, can you think of any instances when the successes would come into play? A Clash of Wills would still use the Mage's Gnosis + Arcana right, and not the successes of the Attainment?

Yes, Clash of Wills is Gnosis + Arcana, even for attainments.

Are there any instances then where this comes up?

Attainments that boost Mage Sight under certain conditions, like the example legacy's first optional attainment.

[GibberingEloquence]

Could Forces Perfecting turn this kind of mundane Equipment into something that deals Aggravated Damage with +1 Reach and 1 Mana? Or at least give it a Lethal Damage Bonus equal to Potency? The spell itself is upgrading a pre-existing weapon that definitely deals Lethal Damage, which is an indirect method. That means you don't need Forces 4 for directly causing Aggravated Damage, in theory.

[21C Hermit]

Could Forces Perfecting turn this kind of mundane Equipment into something that deals Aggravated Damage with +1 Reach and 1 Mana? Or at least give it a Lethal Damage Bonus equal to Potency? The spell itself is upgrading a pre-existing weapon that definitely deals Lethal Damage, which is an indirect method. That means you don't need Forces 4 for directly causing Aggravated Damage, in theory.

Not sure about granting Aggravated damage, but enhancing its (Lethal) damage rating should be perfectly okay. Pun intended.

[TakWrote]

How do spells with both a subject and an area work as far as scale goes?

I ask based on Lodestone which says

As long as the spell remains active, those objects within the spell’s Area are drawn
to the spell’s subject

but I know I've seen other spells with similar effects.

The spellcasting rules specify

Mages must decide when casting whether they are targeting specific subjects or a
blanket area of effect.

Which seems like if Lodestone targets a subject then there's no defined area and if it targets an area, everything in that area is also the subject, so what determines where things are drawn to?

[KaiserAfini]

How do spells with both a subject and an area work as far as scale goes?

I ask based on Lodestone which says
but I know I've seen other spells with similar effects.

The spellcasting rules specify

Which seems like if Lodestone targets a subject then there's no defined area and if it targets an area, everything in that area is also the subject, so what determines where things are drawn to?

I always interpreted it that you should use the AoE range to determine the area that is affected.

[TakWrote]

I always interpreted it that you should use the AoE range to determine the area that is affected

Makes sense and that's what I assumed as well. But the problem I have with that interpretation is that it doesn't tell me where the Area is. Is it a sphere around the subject, or set and immovable like a normal AoE spell?

Moveable sphere centered on the subject which extends to the size of the AoE range makes the most sense to me, it's just not how scale is written to work for areas.

[KaiserAfini]

Makes sense and that's what I assumed as well. But the problem I have with that interpretation is that it doesn't tell me where the Area is. Is it a sphere around the subject, or set and immovable like a normal AoE spell?

Moveable sphere centered on the subject which extends to the size of the AoE range makes the most sense to me, it's just not how scale is written to work for areas.

I think its the area around the subject. Think of it like a Locate Object spell from DND, so long as the target is within the area of effect near the subject or casting point, it will be affected. So if a Moros suddenly meets someone who gives him major bad vibes for no justifiable reason (maybe they never met a Promethean), they could cast Lodestone on them to make a light summer rain drench them. In another occasion, they can cast an AoE version in front of their Sanctum, so they won't have to shovel snow later.

[orathaic]

Makes sense and that's what I assumed as well. But the problem I have with that interpretation is that it doesn't tell me where the Area is. Is it a sphere around the subject, or set and immovable like a normal AoE spell?

Moveable sphere centered on the subject which extends to the size of the AoE range makes the most sense to me, it's just not how scale is written to work for areas.

Usually for AoEs you can define the area upon casting. So it depends on the Imago.

You can define something as 'inside this building' or 'a cone whose tip begins at my finger tip' anything which is simple enough to form the imago.

[orathaic]

This is really a cross over question, but:
If i was looking for closest allied between Seer ministries/Exarchs and Vampire convenants, i would choose:
Invictus - Mammon,
Lancea - the Father,
Circle - Raptor.

Would there be any likely allies between the Ordo Dracul or the Cartian movement and Exarchs or their servants?

[TakWrote]

This is really a cross over question, but:
If i was looking for closest allied between Seer ministries/Exarchs and Vampire convenants, i would choose:
Invictus - Mammon,
Lancea - the Father,
Circle - Raptor.

Would there be any likely allies between the Ordo Dracul or the Cartian movement and Exarchs or their servants?

I think Invictus would probably prefer Unity to Mammon, but it would likely depend on which was the most valuable ally for them in the region.

For the Ordo Dracul, I don't think there's any ministry they would find a natural common ally; they would likely ally with whomever could help progress their research.

The Carthians would likely hate most ministries, but I could see a politically repressed and violent Carthian group working with the Praetorian Ministry as an alliance of pure convenience.

[Satchel]

Would there be any likely allies between the Ordo Dracul or the Cartian movement and Exarchs or their servants?

The Ordo's institutional mythology is that they are specifically doing what they do to spite God, which itself draws from the covenant's rules against subservience to ephemeral beings. Any of the Defiant allying with the Architects of the Lie are therefore likely to be considered whatever the best analog to "heretics" is in that model unless they're extremely good at bullshitting or otherwise working from a position of less-than-perfect description of where they're getting their lucky breaks from.

If a given Exarch's power is aligned with a modern mode of government, you can probably find some Carthians who'd throw in their lot with it for at least as long as it seems viable among the dead, though once that group is in power they're as likely to get kicked out by other Carthians who disagree, particularly given we're talking about system aligned with the Tyrants.

[Cauthon]

Three questions, only one of which is directly mechanics related.

1. Would Kinetic Efficiency make it harder to build muscles? Muscle growth is largely facilitated by straining them, and KE reduces that strain.

2. Neolithic Awakened saw the Watchtowers in a very different way than modern Awakened. Presumably cultural differences have an influence, which compounds over time, but what would other eras look like? Would, say, Viking era Mastigos see something closer to the endless forests rather than the Iron Gauntlet, or the hungry sea rather than the Lead Coin? ^{Also, any theories on why the Neolithic towers were so small? Does each name add to the Watchtower's strength?}

3. Mechanic-ish question, for a theoretical Pocket Dimension base. Relinquished/Indefinite Scrying can be used to make picture windows. Relinquished/Indefinite Co-Location (with the Portal and Visibility Reach) can be used to make doorways and windows, but more importantly air holes. However, doing so has the same effect as leaving your doors and windows open - physical detritus can enter easily, as can trespassers. What would be a way to work around this? Key the portal to only allow air through, and cloak it with Incognito Presence / Invisibility?

[MorganG]

1. Would Kinetic Efficiency make it harder to build muscles? Muscle growth is largely facilitated by straining them, and KE reduces that strain.

The spell and muscle strain are largely orthogonal.

If a person only did the physical actions they could do without the spell then they would experience less strain and less muscle growth.

If they pushed themselves they would still experience fatigue and growth but their actual feats might be superhuman.

KE doesn't help conditioning and might hinder it if used too often. An inverse of KE could be used as a kind of resistance training like weighted clothing which the mage could remove to unleash their Full Potential! at a dramatic moment.

[21C Hermit]

Three questions, only one of which is directly mechanics related.

1. Would Kinetic Efficiency make it harder to build muscles? Muscle growth is largely facilitated by straining them, and KE reduces that strain.

The spell says that it doesn't alter forces and instead maximizes kinetic energy use, so it's probably not as bad as it looks.

I'd be more worried about how your Long-Term Nimbus develops; maybe you'll start running into more and more situations that demand more and more use of bodily force......

2. Neolithic Awakened saw the Watchtowers in a very different way than modern Awakened. Presumably cultural differences have an influence, which compounds over time, but what would other eras look like? Would, say, Viking era Mastigos see something closer to the endless forests rather than the Iron Gauntlet, or the hungry sea rather than the Lead Coin? ^{Also, any theories on why the Neolithic towers were so small? Does each name add to the Watchtower's strength?}

I'd rather stick to the tower-builds-up imagery, for symbolic reasons. The Astral citadels of the Aeons have our Weird Places You Might Recognize quirk covered.

3. Mechanic-ish question, for a theoretical Pocket Dimension base. Relinquished/Indefinite Scrying can be used to make picture windows. Relinquished/Indefinite Co-Location (with the Portal and Visibility Reach) can be used to make doorways and windows, but more importantly air holes. However, doing so has the same effect as leaving your doors and windows open - physical detritus can enter easily, as can trespassers. What would be a way to work around this? Key the portal to only allow air through, and cloak it with Incognito Presence / Invisibility?

Space 3 Ban with Matter 2 for letting in only air works. Ban can't be Keyed, but if the portal's used only for ventilation, then that's actually a plus.

Space 2 Secret Door should be able to hide them.


...... Or we can cast Space 4 Teleportation at empty air and at Indefinite Duration so that it repetitively brings fresh air from outside at each ritual-casting interval. Because screw Wisdom.