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  • #16
    Originally posted by lbeaumanior View Post
    Does requisitioning using Consilium/Order status also cover the new merits (Perfected Item, Mana Battery, etc.) in Sign of Sorcery?
    As long as your Order / Consilium has reasonable access to those resources, then yes.

    As to the Soulstone bit... I'd say it's because high Gnosis Soulstones are (probably?) rarer than low, so Orders are much less likely to give them out. That makes them less available than just their dot rating would imply when it comes to requisitioning.


    Monkish Asexual.

    I make Legacies when I'm bored. They're of middling quality, but have a look if you're interested. Advice and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by lbeaumanior View Post
      The Soul Stone requisitioning on Signs of Sorcery seems wrong, it says as the merit (1 o 2 dots), but +1 if the stone is from a mage with higher Gonisis, and that is what the 2 point of the merit does if you pick it... Am I missing something?
      I would read that as a reminder rather than an additional surcharge.


      Resident Lore-Hound
      Currently Consuming: Demon: the Descent 1e

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      • #18
        Cauthon and Satchel thanks for the answers.

        What about the Soul Stone as Yantra example I put? Any insight on that?



        "When used by another mage as a tool Yantra, soul stones
        offer a +2 die bonus, or +3 if the creator’s Gnosis is higher
        than the user’s. The stone’s form must still be useable for
        the spell.
        "

        So if Mark the Obrimos has a Soul Stone of a higher Gnosis mage that is also a Gold Coin.

        Does he get +1 using the coin as a Yantra, OR +3 because of being a Soul Stone, OR can he use the 2 different Yantras (being a coin and being a Soul Stone) using different Yantra Slots?​

        Essentially, does it being a Soul Stone overrides any Magical Tool Yantra value?
        Last edited by lbeaumanior; 01-24-2023, 12:56 PM. Reason: I just realised that you might have just read the message before I edited those questions.

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        • #19
          My rule of thumb is that the highest bonus applies, assuming all potential Yantra-forms resonate with the spell. The Path of the soulstone might perclude certain spells, like Matter for a Mastigos soulstone, in which case you'd only use the Coin Yantra.


          Monkish Asexual.

          I make Legacies when I'm bored. They're of middling quality, but have a look if you're interested. Advice and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

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          • #20
            Can you use the Space spell Quarantine on a Goetia while in the Astral, and if so, what heppens if it's the Mind-conjunctive version? Does the world forget the Goetia, or the thing that the Goetia represents?


            Monkish Asexual.

            I make Legacies when I'm bored. They're of middling quality, but have a look if you're interested. Advice and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Cauthon View Post
              Can you use the Space spell Quarantine on a Goetia while in the Astral, and if so, what heppens if it's the Mind-conjunctive version? Does the world forget the Goetia, or the thing that the Goetia represents?
              Space looks physical in the Astral, so it should behave similarly. Using the Mind version of Quarantine makes people forget that specific goetia. All concepts are too broad to be fully embodied by one goetia. You may wipe people's memories of Anubis, but there are also other interpretations of death, such as the grim reaper, Nergal, Death from the Endless, Milu, Death from the Discoworld setting, Mandos from Lord of the Rings and many more.


              New experiences are the font of creativity, when seeking inspiration, break your routine.

              The Agathos Kai Sophos, an Acanthus Legacy of strategists (Mind/Time)
              The Szary Strażnik, an Obrimos Legacy whose invisible hands guide through the Glyphs of Fate (Fate/Prime)

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              • #22
                I think with goetia it can go that in the Oneiros they're more intimately connected to the quality they embody, if not outright being that quality seen through a frame of reference that separates it out from everything else and makes it an entity, but in the Temenos it's more something that emerges out of a collective quality of people.

                Still, while I wouldn't say that using Quarantine on, say, the Teenage Rebel causes all teenage rebellion to cease or be forgotten, the expression of that quality can lose a kind of spark while the goetia is absent.


                I have approximate knowledge of many things.
                Write up as I play Xenoblade Chronicles.

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                • #23
                  If you quarentine it will be as if you had destroyed the goetia, but for any significant one it may be replaced by a new one fairly fast...

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by orathaic View Post
                    If you quarentine it will be as if you had destroyed the goetia, but for any significant one it may be replaced by a new one fairly fast...
                    A base Quarantine shouldn't trigger an effect like that - as far as I can tell it would just stop the Goetia from roaming. Which can potentially keep it from interacting meaningfully with other Goetia, but also prevents it from being destroyed of messed with without a good deal of Awakened effort.

                    Mind-conjunctive Quatantine... I don't think it would be like killing them. Quarantine doesn't sever the target's existance, just makes them physically inaccessable. Time-conjunctive Quarantine probably replaces them temporarily, but that's not going to result in a long-term two-fer.


                    Monkish Asexual.

                    I make Legacies when I'm bored. They're of middling quality, but have a look if you're interested. Advice and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

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                    • #25
                      So using Goetic Evocation and using the +2 Reach option to incorporate the Goetia into one's Oneiros and letting it stay there is a bad idea...worse still if the Soul Stone's creator was at Falling Wisdom. So do you think it would be even worse if the Soul Soul was created by one of the Raptured? What would happen?


                      To whomever reads this, I hope you have a good day/night. May you be Happy.

                      So, I made some Mage Legacies here, with some help. They vary in quality, but I hope you take a look at them. Every one contains pieces of me, for better or worse.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by TempleBuilder View Post
                        So using Goetic Evocation and using the +2 Reach option to incorporate the Goetia into one's Oneiros and letting it stay there is a bad idea...worse still if the Soul Stone's creator was at Falling Wisdom. So do you think it would be even worse if the Soul Soul was created by one of the Raptured? What would happen?
                        I feel like the contents of the "Souls of the Rapt" section on page 89 of SoS adequately covers the most likely initial consequences of this.


                        Resident Lore-Hound
                        Currently Consuming: Demon: the Descent 1e

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by TempleBuilder View Post
                          So using Goetic Evocation and using the +2 Reach option to incorporate the Goetia into one's Oneiros and letting it stay there is a bad idea...worse still if the Soul Stone's creator was at Falling Wisdom. So do you think it would be even worse if the Soul Soul was created by one of the Raptured? What would happen?
                          I have specific opinions regarding Rapt soul/soulstone shenanagins that I probably shouldn't share with you. If you're ok with spoilers:

                          Both of these are my opinion, since there aren't any rules on it that I remember. Intergrating a Rapt Goetia automatically gives you Persistent Soul Cracks, as if you had been using the stone as a Yantra or a Desmense. The condition refreshes every [Ritual Interval], which makes it a VERY bad idea to do as a high Gnosis mage. Using Soul Grafting is worse - as long as the graft remains, you gain their Fault, and become a vector for Tulpa.
                          Last edited by Cauthon; 01-25-2023, 11:11 PM.


                          Monkish Asexual.

                          I make Legacies when I'm bored. They're of middling quality, but have a look if you're interested. Advice and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by TempleBuilder View Post
                            So using Goetic Evocation and using the +2 Reach option to incorporate the Goetia into one's Oneiros and letting it stay there is a bad idea...worse still if the Soul Stone's creator was at Falling Wisdom. So do you think it would be even worse if the Soul Soul was created by one of the Raptured? What would happen?
                            That sounds awesome, especially if you can find multiple soulstones from different Rapt mages, you become more and more deeply connected to the Supernal (while eroding your own personal connection) possibly develop multiple (contradictory?) Faults, your Nimbus becomes a mixture of the Nimbuses of the Rapt mages you have in your Oneiros... Almost certainly an Act of Hubris (as uncontrolled Long Term Nimbus is not Wise).

                            Closest thing to a walking verge.

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                            • #29
                              Multiple order status questions:
                              1. What would it mean for a starting character to have high Order Status?
                                I think someone with low Arcana might be impossible on certain orders, I could envision the Free Council granting high status for a low Arcana mage that spends his time working the order goals, but other orders seem to me to be to very be focused on Arcana and Gnosis potence.
                              2. Do you need to know Rotes to actually advance in the Mysterium?
                                I am envisioning a Mage that is focused on spending his experience on growing in understanding (Gnosis) and capabilities (Arcana), but not much focus on formulaic efforts (Rotes)
                              3. Can you get to the high status levels of Silver Ladder on Personal (not Allies, Contacts, Resources just Gnosis + Arcana) power only?
                              4. Do you need to have/be part of Cryptopolies to get to upper levels of status with Silver Ladder?
                              5. Which Order is most likely to have members dedicated to the Order financial matters almost exclusively?
                                I am thinking Silver Ladder and Free Council, but how does the Mysterium finance itself? By selling to other orders? How does the Adamantine Arrow get money? Guardians of the Veil?
                              6. Which Order is most likely to have members exclusively dedicated to the members security and well-being?
                                A mix of human resources AND security office for the Order members. Could include the financial part: guaranteeing income for all members, that their living quarters are at least safe, and that they can be reached in case of need (whether their own needs or the order needing their skills).
                              Thanks,
                              Last edited by lbeaumanior; 01-26-2023, 06:17 PM.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by lbeaumanior View Post
                                Multiple order status questions:
                                1. What would it mean for a starting character to have high Order Status?
                                  I think someone with low Arcana might be impossible on certain orders, I could envision the Free Council granting high status for a low Arcana mage that spends his time working the order goals, but other orders seem to me to be to very be focused on Arcana and Gnosis potence.
                                2. Do you need to know Rotes to actually advance in the Mysterium?
                                  I am envisioning a Mage that is focused on spending his experience on growing in understanding (Gnosis) and capabilities (Arcana), but not much focus on formulaic efforts (Rotes)
                                3. Can you get to the high status levels of Silver Ladder on Personal (not Allies, Contacts, Resources just Gnosis + Arcana) power only?
                                4. Which Order is most likely to have members dedicated to the Order financial matters almost exclusively?
                                  I am thinking Silver Ladder and Free Council, but how does the Mysterium finance itself? By selling to other orders? How does the Adamantine Arrow get money? Guardians of the Veil?
                                5. Which Order is most likely to have members exclusively dedicated to the members security and well-being?
                                  A mix of human resources AND security office for the Order members. Could include the financial part: guaranteeing income for all members, that their living quarters are at least safe, and that they can be reached in case of need (whether their own needs or the order needing their skills).
                                Thanks,
                                1. Apprenticed based nepotism, local emergency incited a shuffling of the power structure, the keeping of a lot of logistical upkeep and direction as a sleeper/sleepwalker prior to Awakening, setting up a patsy, possible consequences of a Metamorphic Awakening or a Destiny, so on and so forth.
                                2. No, but one has to wonder why you'd be hamstringing yourself. Yes, it's ideal to be able to improvise with mastery, but Rotes are among the most powerful Yantras out there, and their acquisition also tends to bring forth a lot of the other things that would get you lots of kudos in the Mysterium.EDIT: Also, this sounds familiar.
                                3. In theory, yes, and in fact the ideal is such. In practice though, one again has to ask why you'd want to hamstring yourself, particularly since the merits mentioned are among some of the most powerful in the game. It's hard to be a Sage with cults working towards the metaphysical and spiritual liberation of the human race if you don't have cults.
                                4. The Seers of the Throne. Though, the real answer is "All of them, the Seers just have an in." Global mystery religions need them that cash flow.
                                5. The Guardians, followed closely by the Arrows. Though, again, the real answer is all of them.
                                Last edited by ArcaneArts; 01-26-2023, 05:58 PM.


                                Kelly R.S. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
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